Elevated work safety: A little help - Page 2 - Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum

BBQ · 04-19-2012, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 360max

....we are required to be 100% tied off regardless of lift type, I'd have to see that OSHA standard to believe it. Note, when you are on any lift and even put your foot up on the toe rail, that requires 100% tie off or it is an OSHA violation

Fedearal OSHA treats sissor lifts as staging and just like staging you do not need to be tied off if there are full rails.

I do agree with you that if you want to climb the rails tie off is needed.

BBQ · 04-19-2012, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicken steve

Osha fined a worker here , 'manlift on concrete no saftey harness'

and other than an on line resource (which many are not privey to, or eshew) there are no local Osha realted courses

bit of a Guaqmire imho......~CS~

Of course they could fight the judgment and win, it happens often.

Boomer · 04-19-2012, 09:47 AM

I've had those scenarios run through my grape from time to time as well...falling while tied off to lift and having it tip on top of me. But, when you think about it, you'd be falling straight down the side of the lift. The weight transfer would be totally vertical, limiting the possibility of the lift to be pulled down side-ways.

Good post though, even though I can't find the OSHA regulation that says you have to be tied off on the lift, we are told it is required any time you step foot on the lift.

BBQ · 04-19-2012, 09:53 AM

Certainly some areas, bussnesses etc require tie off but fed OSHA does not.

The following is from OSHA

Quote:

In regards to your specific question, when working from an elevated scissors lift (ANSI A92.6 series), a worker need only be protected from falling by a properly designed and maintained guardrail system. However, if the guardrail system is less than adequate, or the worker leaves the safety of the work platform, an additional fall protection device would be required. The general scaffolding fall protection provision found in 1926.451(g)(1)(vii) reads in part, "[f]or all scaffolds not otherwise specified in this section, each employee shall be protected by the use of personal fall arrest systems or guardrails systems."

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owad...ONS&p_id=22611

CanadianBrad · 04-19-2012, 07:23 PM

While the OSHA information is pretty handy, it doesn't apply here(Canadian). Also, regardless of what the Canada- or Alberta-wide safety protocols are(and I couldn't tell you what they are off the top of my head), it is a rule for the site. That being said, while a safety guy may nag you about it from time to time, they don't actually do anything about it. Same goes for my boss.

However, I'm interested to hear if you guys use lanyards while on these things, and if you actually tie off to them.

angryceltic · 04-19-2012, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianBrad

While the OSHA information is pretty handy, it doesn't apply here(Canadian). Also, regardless of what the Canada- or Alberta-wide safety protocols are(and I couldn't tell you what they are off the top of my head), it is a rule for the site. That being said, while a safety guy may nag you about it from time to time, they don't actually do anything about it. Same goes for my boss.

However, I'm interested to hear if you guys use lanyards while on these things, and if you actually tie off to them.

Manufacture states that if there is a tie off point it is to be used. This covers their liability. The tie off is fall prevention to where it's a leash to keep u in the bucket/ basket. Does not matter the style of lift.

The gc on this site has a mandatory tie off rule on anything over six feet. On the staging for the masons there is fall arrest protection as well. My employer has the same rules. Anything over 6 feet.

Dhfisher · 04-26-2012, 09:42 PM

Sometimes things that OSHA requires makes no sense, the plant I worked at required a tie off above 6ft. The " monkey tail" was 10ft long, the idea is that the tail consists of material pleated together with thread that in case of a fall rips out and slows down the speed of the fall before reaching the end of the tail, what good is the tie off if it's longer than the fall and the rip stop is not even into play yet? We get back to the question of liability at this point, if we are using the required equipment the liability falls not in our lap, the Co. Is clear, OSHA is happy, all Edicts have been followed, common sense is lacking, but that's ok, all edicts have been followed. It is up to us to use common sense to protect ourselves also, not just our employer. I will absolutely not do anything that would jeopardize my well being, although I dislike the safety harness if I am off the ground at a height I will wear it, same thing goes for other safety apparatus if common sense tells me to wear it I shall. Too often we bring on these regulations by not using common sense, then big bro. Steps in and is willing to protect us from ourselves. As Pogo said " I have met the enemy, he is us." well this is the end of my " rant" Keep Safe.

acebradley · 04-26-2012, 10:42 PM

My understanding was always that if the manufacturer of the lift requires it (tie-off) in the operating manual, then it is required by OSHA. OSHA requires every person that uses the equipment to read the manual, be trained, and be familiar with the operating instructions contain therein.

BBQ · 04-27-2012, 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhfisher

Sometimes things that OSHA requires makes no sense, the plant I worked at required a tie off above 6ft. The " monkey tail" was 10ft long, the idea is that the tail consists of material pleated together with thread that in case of a fall rips out and slows down the speed of the fall before reaching the end of the tail, what good is the tie off if it's longer than the fall and the rip stop is not even into play yet? We get back to the question of liability at this point, if we are using the required equipment the liability falls not in our lap, the Co. Is clear, OSHA is happy, all Edicts have been followed, common sense is lacking, but that's ok, all edicts have been followed. It is up to us to use common sense to protect ourselves also, not just our employer. I will absolutely not do anything that would jeopardize my well being, although I dislike the safety harness if I am off the ground at a height I will wear it, same thing goes for other safety apparatus if common sense tells me to wear it I shall. Too often we bring on these regulations by not using common sense, then big bro. Steps in and is willing to protect us from ourselves. As Pogo said " I have met the enemy, he is us." well this is the end of my " rant" Keep Safe.

Actually using too long a lanyard is a violation in it self.

BBQ · 04-27-2012, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angryceltic

Manufacture states that if there is a tie off point it is to be used. This covers their liability. The tie off is fall prevention to where it's a leash to keep u in the bucket/ basket. Does not matter the style of lift.

.

Again, this is not fed OSHA policy, you certainly may have been told that but what I posted above is a official fed OSHA interpretation

It does in fact matter what kind of lift, scissor lifts are mobile scaffolds.

Big John · 04-27-2012, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhfisher

Sometimes things that OSHA requires makes no sense, the plant I worked at required a tie off above 6ft. The " monkey tail" was 10ft long, the idea is that the tail consists of material pleated together with thread that in case of a fall rips out and slows down the speed of the fall before reaching the end of the tail, what good is the tie off if it's longer than the fall and the rip stop is not even into play yet?....

The problem there isn't OSHA, it's just another case of a half-assed safety department.

This is an OSHA interpretation that answers a lot of the common questions about work from ladders, and fall arrest when working at low heights.

Long story short: OSHA doesn't require fall protection on portable ladders, and if fall protection is required, but you can still hit the ground while wearing it, it is definitely an OSHA violation.

-John

BBQ · 04-27-2012, 05:21 AM

We often complain that there is no way to get official NEC interpretations but with OSHA it is usally as easy as a quick search of their site.

Big John · 04-27-2012, 05:24 AM

How awesome would it be if the NFPA started giving official interpretations? It makes a hell of a lot of sense: What good is a rule nobody understands?

-John

TimChaput69 · 04-27-2012, 08:05 AM

We have OSHA into our GE facility every year for two weeks to do safety inspections. "DIRECTLY" asked an OSHA official if tie off is required in scissor lifts and been told NO. As long as there is railing and toe lip there is no OSHA requirement to tie off. If you step on the rails then tie-off is required. Which is great because some of the safety requirements we have at this facility are crazy. Have you ever read the OSHA requirement for ladder safety? By their standards you can't even go up the ladder to tie off. 3 points of contact at all times, no carrying tools, and when and if you get to the top of the ladder you have to work with one hand to maintain 3 points of contact!!

MaxFuse · 05-20-2012, 10:10 PM

We also are required to be 100% tied off on scizzor lifts over 6 ft.
Their argument was the manufacturers supplied the lifts with attachment loops, therefore, they were designed to be used per manufacturer's suggested operating procedures.
Sounds like a bunch of bull***t to me, just another way to point the finger at someone else.
My question is why the heck are the point of attachment so low? They aren't this way on a boom lift. When you turn around the lanyard wraps around your ankles, doesnt seem too safe to me.

But really, what do they care, they aren't going to be wearing them.
Kind of like our congress and the rules they force upon us that don't apply to them.

MaxFuse · 05-20-2012, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TimChaput69

We have OSHA into our GE facility every year for two weeks to do safety inspections. "DIRECTLY" asked an OSHA official if tie off is required in scissor lifts and been told NO. As long as there is railing and toe lip there is no OSHA requirement to tie off. If you step on the rails then tie-off is required. Which is great because some of the safety requirements we have at this facility are crazy. Have you ever read the OSHA requirement for ladder safety? By their standards you can't even go up the ladder to tie off. 3 points of contact at all times, no carrying tools, and when and if you get to the top of the ladder you have to work with one hand to maintain 3 points of contact!!

That three point contact is a joke.
1. How many men does it take to mount one stick of emt on a 8-10 ft flat ceiling with 1 hole straps.
(Takes 2 men to mount one 1900 box ?)
2. Can you even get that many ladders that close together?
3. Who is going to pay the added cost for this insanity?
Certainly not the Bats***t crazy rule makers.

Big John · 05-20-2012, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxFuse

That three point contact is a joke....

Honestly, I think so, too. And I have never seen the OSHA reg that actually requires it.

-John

sparky970 · 05-20-2012, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhfisher;[URL="tel:699640"

699640[/url]]Sometimes things that OSHA requires makes no sense, the plant I worked at required a tie off above 6ft. The " monkey tail" was 10ft long, the idea is that the tail consists of material pleated together with thread that in case of a fall rips out and slows down the speed of the fall before reaching the end of the tail, what good is the tie off if it's longer than the fall and the rip stop is not even into play yet? We get back to the question of liability at this point, if we are using the required equipment the liability falls not in our lap, the Co. Is clear, OSHA is happy, all Edicts have been followed, common sense is lacking, but that's ok, all edicts have been followed. It is up to us to use common sense to protect ourselves also, not just our employer. I will absolutely not do anything that would jeopardize my well being, although I dislike the safety harness if I am off the ground at a height I will wear it, same thing goes for other safety apparatus if common sense tells me to wear it I shall. Too often we bring on these regulations by not using common sense, then big bro. Steps in and is willing to protect us from ourselves. As Pogo said " I have met the enemy, he is us." well this is the end of my " rant" Keep Safe.

That's where you would use a yo-yo. You need to use common sense if your fall arrest device won't stop you before you hit the ground, then you need to use other methods, Remember you have fall restraint and fall arrest systems.

Wireman191 · 05-21-2012, 11:27 PM

Not on scissor lifts. When we are in a snorkel lift we always tie off.
If I'm going to be leaning over the handrail I will put on a harness and tie off. I really think I would rather take my chances of the lift toppling over on me vs a free fall. I'm sure it could possibly happen, but were probably talking 1 in a million chance.
I bet your lift tie off point is 100xs better then the anchors your putting in the concrete celling to tie off to.

Wireman191 · 05-21-2012, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhfisher

Sometimes things that OSHA requires makes no sense, the plant I worked at required a tie off above 6ft. The " monkey tail" was 10ft long, the idea is that the tail consists of material pleated together with thread that in case of a fall rips out and slows down the speed of the fall before reaching the end of the tail, what good is the tie off if it's longer than the fall and the rip stop is not even into play yet? We get back to the question of liability at this point, if we are using the required equipment the liability falls not in our lap, the Co. Is clear, OSHA is happy, all Edicts have been followed, common sense is lacking, but that's ok, all edicts have been followed. It is up to us to use common sense to protect ourselves also, not just our employer. I will absolutely not do anything that would jeopardize my well being, although I dislike the safety harness if I am off the ground at a height I will wear it, same thing goes for other safety apparatus if common sense tells me to wear it I shall. Too often we bring on these regulations by not using common sense, then big bro. Steps in and is willing to protect us from ourselves. As Pogo said " I have met the enemy, he is us." well this is the end of my " rant" Keep Safe.

You use a yo-yo then, And the yo-yo does not hook to a lanyard, It hooks directly to the ring on your harness.