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Old 12-12-2016, 02:35 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by MattM-NC View Post
I don't understand the use of "apprentice" "journeyman" and "master".
The NC Board of Examiners of Electrical Contractors doesn't use this terminology, and neither does my boss. Is this a union thing? Is there actually a formal "journeyman" license in some states? Or is it just an informal way of saying, "I'm not new anymore, but I'm still learning."
I'm one state south of you and we do have these terms and what these terms mean.
We don't use the term apprentice much because most new guys in the trade here are not apprentices and do not track hours.
We have Journeyman and Masters in SC and each title requires specific time in the trade and to be able to pass a licensing exam.

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Originally Posted by Essex View Post
Out of interest is it just hours that pushes you up the ranks or is there exams/inspections on your workmanship along the way?
Also how do you account for the hours?
W2 forms verify the hours. Testing verifies the ability/knowledge of the license applicant.
Remember the discussion on videos? Those videos were designed to help with the testing.

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Originally Posted by MattM-NC View Post
I just got this response from an email I sent last week to the North Carolina Board of Examiners of Electrical Contractors:

"We consider a “journeyman electrician” an individual that know the supplies to pack on the truck, run the job without assistance. We typically leave it up to the employer to decide if the employee is of that capacity. Journeyman electrician is PRIMARY EXPERIENCE. Thank you, Michelle Ames/NC Board of Examiners of Electrical Contractors"
Sounds silly to me.
I would look it up myself. Dennis Alwon is licensed in your state and a moderator here. Maybe he can shed some light on this.
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Old 12-12-2016, 03:37 PM   #22
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Sounds silly to me.
I would look it up myself. Dennis Alwon is licensed in your state and a moderator here. Maybe he can shed some light on this.

Sounds strange to me, but strange things do happen.
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Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now
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Old 12-17-2016, 12:23 PM   #23
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Every state is different on their classification system.
In general:
Apprentice: 0-5 years in the trade. Some areas require attending classes. Needs to be supervised by journeyman or apprentice.

Journeyman: Has experience in the trade and passed an electrical test. 4-5 years documented experience is common. Classroom experience may be needed or more years experience. Can supervise an apprentice.

Master: More experience required, like 6-8 years. Classroom experience may be needed or even more years experience. Test is longer and much harder than journeyman exam. Can supervise an apprentice. A electrical contractor may need to have a master electrician registered with them. Other areas it's called an electrical contractor exam. About the same thing except it includes a business law test.

Now where it gets confusing is may places have the above classifications in different categories. Such as a residential journeyman, commercial journeyman, unlimited journeyman, sign journeyman, oilfield journeyman, etc... The more limited categories are much easier to qualify for, such as a sign electrician. Where the unlimited (work on most everything) is the most demanding of requirements to qualify.

For the IBEW there is a journeyman wireman and apprentice electrician. No master level. You can also break it down into different categories like maintenance, sign, resi, etc. There are also commercial electricians and commercial wireman at some locals.

The difference is the first is the state or local license to work.
The second is the job classification at the union hall.
They don't always match.

In areas that licensing is not enforced or pushed companies or the workers tend to make their own title. Such as "I've worked for 5 years, I'm a journeyman", yet had no education or testing. Or calling a person an apprentice that is not in an apprenticeship.

Most areas require documented experience to qualify for an exam. If you can't document it, then it didn't happen. Don't expect your past employer to write you a letter stating you worked for cash.

1099 is never a good way for an individual not in business to work for a company.
You give up a ton of workers rights. Later if you claim unemployment they will say their records show you didn't work. You look back on your Social Security earnings and see a $0 for the year. You get hurt and your SOL. Don't call the DOL if you didn't get paid. You can forget about overtime pay and break period requirements. The end of the year you'll probably owe money and possibly penalties for not paying the IRS quarterly.
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Old 12-17-2016, 12:59 PM   #24
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For the IBEW there is a journeyman wireman and apprentice electrician. No master level. You can also break it down into different categories like maintenance, sign, resi, etc. There are also commercial electricians and commercial wireman at some locals.
There is no rule that a union journeyman cannot take a Masters test and carry a license that I know of.
In fact, I would think that would give him or her a leg up on foreman or supervisor pay grade.
Might even get him in the office as a PM.
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Old 12-17-2016, 01:45 PM   #25
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There is no rule that a union journeyman cannot take a Masters test and carry a license that I know of.
In fact, I would think that would give him or her a leg up on foreman or supervisor pay grade.
Might even get him in the office as a PM.
That's what I meant where I wrote they don't always match between union classification and state / local licensing.

It's 2 separate things, a license and a job classification.

In IBEW you're classified as a JW no matter if you have a local journeyman or master license. If your found to be qualified as a JW you take a JW call. There is no maser electrician calls. Don't confuse the matter. Yes you can be a licensed master. But the calls (jobs) are for a JW.

Holding a masters lic vs a journeymans lic is not reverent in this area to union contractors. If anything they are more concerned with certs to hire.

Last edited by active1; 12-17-2016 at 01:50 PM.
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Old 12-18-2016, 02:02 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by John Valdes View Post
Sounds silly to me.
I would look it up myself. Dennis Alwon is licensed in your state and a moderator here. Maybe he can shed some light on this.
You are the second person in this thread to recommend "looking it up". Is not the website for the NC Board of Examiners of Electrical Contractors and a member of that board the final authority? Or is there another regulating agency...
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Old 12-18-2016, 05:40 PM   #27
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In Massachusetts you are an apprentice until you take your journeymans test. In order to take that test you need 8000 hours in the field verified by a licensed electrician and 600 school hours. It works out to 4 years. For a masters, you have to hold a journeymans for a year and take another 150 hours of class.

In Massachusetts you need a journeymans license to work and a Masters to hire journeymen because they want 2 renewal fees out of us........ Communists
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