Unprofessional, but does it violate the code? - Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum
CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY, IT'S FREE!
Go Back   Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum > Tools, Equipment & Safety > Code Violation Discussion


Like Tree33Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-20-2016, 08:32 PM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Question Unprofessional, but does it violate the code?

Hi, I took a photo of an installation I found a little... interesting, to say the least. I sent it to my boss and he gave me a little hw assignment. He asked me to spot the code violations, or determine if there actually are any. He's fine with me using the internet as a resource. I attached the photo below. At first I thought that running raceways through a window was an obvious violation but I don't know exactly which section that would be. I know that you probably aren't allowed to run wire through plumbing pipe either, but again not sure where in the code that would be. It's also possible there's no wire run through the plumber's pipe, that might just be the whip from an AC unit that used to be there tucked into the drain pipe??? Can you help me spot the code violations here and what sections are violated? Any violations regarding the box being on a sidewalk right off Main Street? I'd appreciate any tips, thanks for your time.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Join Contractor Talk

Join the #1 Electrician Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

ElectricianTalk.com - Are you a Professional Electrical Contractor? If so we invite you to join our community and see what it has to offer. Our site is specifically designed for you and it's the leading place for electricians to meet online. No homeowners asking DIY questions. Just fellow tradesmen who enjoy talking about their business, their trade, and anything else that comes up. No matter what your specialty is you'll find that ElectricianTalk.com is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally free!

Join ElectricianTalk.com - Click Here JOIN FOR FREE


Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. ElectricianTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 07-20-2016, 08:35 PM   #2
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

Wasn't able to post the link to the picture for some reason, let's see if this works.
https://goo.gl/photos/SC1JGPJQ34TrGnrL7
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 08:42 PM   #3
Petulant Amateur
 
99cents's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Perky Nipples, Canada
Posts: 14,036
Rewards Points: 8,256
Default

Did he tell you to go on the internet to find the code violations?
Majewski likes this.
99cents is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 08:43 PM   #4
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

Yeah he encourages it actually, always tells me youtube, google, web forums are great resources.
Majewski likes this.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 08:48 PM   #5
Petulant Amateur
 
99cents's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Perky Nipples, Canada
Posts: 14,036
Rewards Points: 8,256
Default

I think it's something you should try figuring out on your own first.
wildleg, Majewski and RRF like this.
99cents is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 08:52 PM   #6
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

I have actually, and was surprised I didn't find anything, but then I guess the people who write the code can't foresee every crazy thing somebody out there might try. Anybody else willing to help?
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 09:00 PM   #7
Coffee drinking member
 
Wirenuting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 10,524
Rewards Points: 2,536
Default

Well Lonnie,
I would bet the bending radius of that PVC is a little tight for the LTFMC stuffed inside it..

Go from there and see what you can look up.
__________________
Teacher, my brain is full... Can I go home now?
Wirenuting is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Wirenuting For This Useful Post:
TexElecApprentice (07-20-2016)
Old 07-20-2016, 09:03 PM   #8
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

Thanks for the tip, Wirenuting!
Wirenuting and Majewski like this.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 09:14 PM   #9
Coffee drinking member
 
Wirenuting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 10,524
Rewards Points: 2,536
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexElecApprentice View Post
Thanks for the tip, Wirenuting!
I'm sure that if you opened the disconnect and looked, you would find more.
Also, why is it outside? What does it disconnect and can it be tagged out properly? Is the wire stuffed inside that PVC? I'm sure the sealtite doesn't make that 90.

I'm sure there is a story behind what we see. Without more info, it's hard to find a violation?

Is this abandoned or a temp set up? If so would there be any violation?



(Taking a second look at the picture, I know what this is.)
__________________
Teacher, my brain is full... Can I go home now?

Last edited by Wirenuting; 07-20-2016 at 09:17 PM.
Wirenuting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 09:50 PM   #10
corn-fused
 
papaotis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: on the river, near the corn
Posts: 4,561
Rewards Points: 332
Default

id say the plumbing pipe is a violation. have look up the code section. hmm, come to think of it ,i dont remember a code that forbids it.well, unless you wanna go with 'listed for the purpose' thing!
__________________
i like neat! just doesnt always happen
papaotis is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to papaotis For This Useful Post:
TGGT (07-20-2016)
Old 07-20-2016, 09:54 PM   #11
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

You mentioned the disconnect, and that reminded me that most, possibly all equipment, has to have the disconnect capable of being locked in the open position if the equipment is not within sight of the disconnect. This disconnect is not within sight of any equipment, so that's most likely a violation because it doesn't look like you can lock it in the open position. The exact code violation section would depend on what equipment its disconnecting, correct? The bend radius code for LFMC refers you to Table 2, Chapter 9, Other Bends. This looks to me like 3/4 or 1", the bend radius of the curve to the centerline must be 5 or 6 depending on whether its 3/4 or 1". That being said, I have to confess that I don't entirely understand what the bend radius of the curve to the centerline actually is. 350.24 says the bend must be made without damaging the conduit, bending the LFMC like that will probably break the flex on the inside, so that's a violation. 350.30A says LFMC must be securely fastened, stuffing it inside PVC isn't securely fastened for sure, so that's a violation. Of course, all this is predicated on the idea that there is actually wire in there and its not abandoned. I'm wondering though, is there anywhere in the code that says here's what you can use for conduit and here's what you can't? Is it actually legal to use plumbers pipe as a raceway. I thought about the window issue a little bit more, technically speaking the LFMC is going between framing members, which is permitted, so maybe that not's a violation after all.
Wirenuting and Majewski like this.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:05 PM   #12
Coffee drinking member
 
Wirenuting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 10,524
Rewards Points: 2,536
Default

Is it possible that I've removed the AC compressor and cut the lineset?
The breaker inside is locked & tagged.
The whip end is stuffed into the evaporator pan drain line, just to keep it outa the way.
New unit to arrive in xxdays.


So now I ask, "Is there any violations that you can see?"


I've learned that sometimes it's hard to pick out violations when I have no knowledge of what the other journeyman has done.

I think your boss is right in you searching for violations the way you are.
Your learning to spot and search for each small item.
Your also learning that somethings might not be what they seem to be.
__________________
Teacher, my brain is full... Can I go home now?

Last edited by Wirenuting; 07-20-2016 at 10:09 PM.
Wirenuting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:06 PM   #13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

papaotis, that's true, that could be a violation of the listed for purpose section. I forget what section that was, need to look it up and commit it to memory.
Wirenuting and Majewski like this.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:07 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: US
Posts: 2,087
Rewards Points: 1,432
Default

Consider workman like manner. How would the inspector feel about this installation? Even if this were perfectly code compliant, unless you're willing to take this to court you'll likely have to yield to the inspector.

Probably not the answer you were looking for, but keep it in mind when you consider copying this kind of install.
TGGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:10 PM   #15
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

Yeah Wirenuting, in that case there might not be any code violation here.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:12 PM   #16
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 20
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TGGT View Post
Consider workman like manner. How would the inspector feel about this installation? Even if this were perfectly code compliant, unless you're willing to take this to court you'll likely have to yield to the inspector.

Probably not the answer you were looking for, but keep it in mind when you consider copying this kind of install.
Yep, TGGT, that's another thing I didn't consider. Running it through the window sill like that just seems tacky, not workmanlike.
TexElecApprentice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:13 PM   #17
Coffee drinking member
 
Wirenuting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 10,524
Rewards Points: 2,536
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexElecApprentice View Post
Yeah Wirenuting, in that case there might not be any code violation here.
And I agree with TGGT.

Built it well and you will be proud to own it.
__________________
Teacher, my brain is full... Can I go home now?
Wirenuting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:14 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: US
Posts: 2,087
Rewards Points: 1,432
Default



Here's the photo for those that don't feel like clicking.
TGGT is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to TGGT For This Useful Post:
Bird dog (07-21-2016), Majewski (07-20-2016), TexElecApprentice (07-20-2016), zac (07-21-2016)
Old 07-20-2016, 10:33 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
Voltron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Mi
Posts: 2,381
Rewards Points: 304
Default

Why is the disco outside, if the load is inside??
Majewski likes this.
Voltron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2016, 10:41 PM   #20
Coffee drinking member
 
Wirenuting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 10,524
Rewards Points: 2,536
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voltron View Post
Why is the disco outside, if the load is inside??
It may be the AC compressor. Someone stole it????
Majewski likes this.
__________________
Teacher, my brain is full... Can I go home now?
Wirenuting is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
P.S. Knight 2015 Code book emtnut Canadian Electrical Code Forum 6 06-04-2016 09:31 PM
Electronic Version of Code Daveon Canadian Electrical Code Forum 10 04-21-2016 06:25 PM
Canadian Electrical Code 8-104 (8) - underground conductor sizing jjdoerksen Canadian Electrical Code Forum 7 04-19-2016 03:50 PM
code revisions Destarah Canadian Electrical Code Forum 2 02-21-2016 12:07 PM
Canadian code for installing a dishwasher in a residential home. elechichen Canadian Electrical Code Forum 21 01-20-2016 11:37 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:30 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Our Pro Sites Network
ContractorTalk.com | DrywallTalk.com | HVACSite.com | PaintTalk.com | PlumbingZone.com | RoofingTalk.com