charlie Bob

I was asked to place a bid on a 3000 sq ft home. no decora or nothing, no can lights, just fluorescent and incandesent fixtures. it's a story and a half house, with 2 bedrooms,laundry room,breakfast room,dining room,living room and 3 bathrooms , one with a whirlpool, downstairs, there's a green house/screen porch attached to the house where a hot tub it's gonna be as well. Garage and basic kitchen with garbage disposal,trash compactor and dishwasher. Upstairs has 2 bedroom and another bathroom. There's gonna be 2 water heaters, 2 HVAC split units. 4 ton unit and 1 1/2 ton unit for upstairs.400 amp service lateral.
I figured there will about 85 receptacles,30 single pole switches, twelve 3 way, with one 4 way. I haven't done a house this big before, i stay pretty busy doing about 900 and 1100 sq ft appartments around here. My last bid for a new house didn't go to well, lost it by a couple of thousands i was told.. . i'd like to get this one.
I figured it would take about 2,750/3,000 ft of 12/2 to tackle all the 110 circuits.( i only use 20 amp in my panel boxes. i know it's overkill for some folks but that's how i do it). Does that sound about right?
And if any out there has done houses close to these dimentions and caracteristics, could you tell me how long did it take you all? including labor time and how many guys? the final price probably wiil be different based on location. we are in rural area, where houses don't build that frequently, but thi time should be about the same anywhere..I sure appreciate your help. thanks

B4T

If you are bidding a new house and using #12 for everything.. there is no chance of making even lunch money on it IF you win the bid..

Nobody here runs #12 unless you have a 10,000 sq ft mansion to wire..

__________________
The Associated Press wants to stop using the term "Illegal Aliens".. they say it is demeaning.. .. instead they want us to use Undocumented Democrats... Jay Leno..

charlie Bob

i see your point it's just the way people usually do it here too. there's no difference on the breaker, same price. The way i look at it is : in a $300,000. house, does $300 /$400 difference in wire make a difference?

HARRY304E

Keep in mind two things.

1) Use 14/wire unless otherwise needed//Like the kitchen/Bathroom circuits.

Running all #12 was great when 1,000' was $65 the fact is you can't get 250' for that price anymore so use the 14 where you can by code and save the money.

2) make sure you include the price of AFCI breakers $50 each.


The amount man hours depends on your men and how neet and workman like you want the job to look.

How long does it take your men to rough out a 900-1,100sq house?

__________________

ES2 Flat Rate , The best $99 I've ever spent ..

HARRY304E

That's $400 you can use elsewhere.

__________________

ES2 Flat Rate , The best $99 I've ever spent ..

B4T

If the plans don't have wire specs in the FPN.. you might be the only guy using all #12..

Normally plans will only say "to code"..

__________________
The Associated Press wants to stop using the term "Illegal Aliens".. they say it is demeaning.. .. instead they want us to use Undocumented Democrats... Jay Leno..

HARRY304E

Plus i think it was ZOG that put up a post about how it is not a good idea to use all 20 amp circuits in a house because it lessens the chances of breakers tripping because of low amperage arching.

__________________

ES2 Flat Rate , The best $99 I've ever spent ..

normel

If you can't be convinced to use 14ga everywhere you can, at least use it for all the lighting circuits. As others have said, factor in AFCI breakers, and if it is a 400A service, there will be an increased cost for the 320/400 meter base and two 200A disconnects and MLO panels.

mdfriday

You are thinking incorrectly as you are starting with the wrong number....

This electrical work is not $300,000. 30,000 - maybe. 30,000 / 400 = 1.3% of the job.

For a good number of companies, that would represent a large portion of the profit, maybe 10% of the profit. Do you want to give away 10% or so of your profit? Why?

Speedy Petey

Overkill is not always a good thing.
What about multi-gang boxes with dimmers? Etc?
#12 sucks in cases like this, which in bigger homes is almost everywhere.

__________________
Time flies when you're goin' fast.

HARRY304E

Funny how those switches keep getting bigger as well.

__________________

ES2 Flat Rate , The best $99 I've ever spent ..

Salvatoreg02

If there are no high hats what so ever and to me a 200 service is sufficient. If the service is above ground $13,000 is a very good number to start with. This will include one cable/tel drop in every room. My cost per outlet is roughly $41.00 per outlet complete, excluding light fixtures.
It also includes wiring up to AC zones as well as furnace/boiler.
Re: the price reflects min code accept for lighting which I include one fixture per room.
It will take when everything said and done about
5 days to rough 2 days finish trim based on 2 guys per day.
One guy per day roughing will take a lot more like 10days.
And I would def not use 12AWG for the whole house it's overkill
And it will take you more time to do and you really have to watch box fill when using 12 especially when used for lighting outlet switch boxes

__________________
Sal
P.E.S

Shockdoc

The guy who uses #14 and backstabs will surely undercut your bid. You might want to reconsider the #12 thing if you really want that job or demonstrate a good selling tactic for the #12 wire advantage. If they are only interested in price, I would bid #14 wire.

__________________
All these liberal laws has turned me into a right wingnut..

wesleydnunder

Here you would be bidding apples to apples with the other contractors. Our city ordinances don't allow #14 or back-stabbed devices.

Mark

Dnkldorf

There is a couple opportunities I see here.

You could up sell them on the advantages of a total 12ga min wiring job. Even if there miniscule, mention it.

Explain what the "competition" does or is likely to use, how you use better materials, wiring..yada,yada,yada....and add an extra grand for difference.

Don't lie or make stuff up...

Bid it using 15a circuits where "code min" says, and than add an option to do it your way, for additional grand.

Heck, you could add another 20% to your quote, but you have to sell it.......that's the hard part people have......selling it for you want, not what they want...

electrictim510

I would rather run more circuits than run all 12's personally. I try to wire in 14 as much as I can get away with. It is just so much easier to work with, especially in cans.

__________________
"Understand one thing every one has a place in this trade, and no matter what your skill set I doubt you know it all." brian john

SHADOW

Sell the job with #14,
if you get the job,offer the client a upgrade in #12 ,
you won't have to sell the all job,just the extra for upgrade,much easyer.

hardworkingstiff

Bid according to the plans, and if you think it's a good value, sell the customer on more money for the #12, but you need to bid against your competition and unless it's on the plans, they will bid #14 and not consider voltage drop.

Get in front of the customer and sell them on you. Then sell the price of the job.

Good luck.

__________________
asomatous
Lou

charlie Bob

My load calculation came to 237 amps, . . . 200 amp service won't be enough.

chicken steve

15K house

service $20 a ft if UG

~CS~