FYI for Northern NJ electricians. - Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum

captkirk · 07-13-2009, 01:25 PM

Just want to let you guys know that the Inspector in Montclair is by far one of the toughest guys ive come across to date. If you plan on working there just make sure all your t's are crossed and I's are dotted. He is going to ask you everything under the sun. And then when you think he is done he will ask you to turn off breakers and good stuff like that. I was lucky enough to be ready for all his questions. And he is not afraid to get dirty or climb into attics and crawl spaces.

drsparky · 07-13-2009, 01:28 PM

Turn off breakers? What is he looking for?

Mr. Sparkle · 07-13-2009, 01:33 PM

Sounds like a good inspector. My CEU teacher is an inspector and Vocational teacher and he is the same way. No ego, just thorough. I enjoy it because I shoot questions off to him and get no BS answers. He even advises that we EC's should call the DCA when dealing with an EI who makes up his own rules.

captkirk · 07-13-2009, 01:33 PM

He wanted to know what else was on a certain lighting circut so I told him it was limited to the room we were in. He asked me what the lighting load was and I told him. And I used the largest bulb possible in the cans in question. So then he asked me to go turn the breaker which i did and all checked out like i told him. That was a first for me.

captkirk · 07-13-2009, 01:36 PM

He asked me a bunch of questions. I kind of liked it. But I was surprised to hear that you are not supposed to put a cord on a dishwasher if it doenst come with one already on...? I thought i was doing right by installing cords so you can use it as the disconnect. He told me you have to install a breaker lock instead. And I know what article he is refering to but to say that a certain dishwasher is not rated to have a cord is a little bit of a strech for me.

Mr. Sparkle · 07-13-2009, 01:58 PM

Man I use old cord ends all the time (Not if they are weathered or damaged in any way.....) for InSinkerators, instahots, DW's, etc etc etc.......guess that will stop.

When I go to the town dump they have a giant electronics dumpster, I just lop off all the heavy duty 3 prong ends I see.

Magnettica · 07-13-2009, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captkirk

He asked me a bunch of questions. I kind of liked it. But I was surprised to hear that you are not supposed to put a cord on a dishwasher if it doenst come with one already on...? I thought i was doing right by installing cords so you can use it as the disconnect. He told me you have to install a breaker lock instead. And I know what article he is refering to but to say that a certain dishwasher is not rated to have a cord is a little bit of a strech for me.

Would seem to be ok by me and I do the same thing.

this is from the '05

Quote:

422.16 Flexible Cords. (B)(2) Built-in Dishwashers and Trash Compactors.
Built-in dishwashers and trash compactors shall be permitted to be
cord-and-plug connected with a ﬂexible cord identiﬁed as
suitable for the purpose in the installation instructions of
the appliance manufacturer where all of the following con-
ditions are met.
(1) The ﬂexible cord shall be terminated with a grounding-
type attachment plug.
Exception: A listed dishwasher or trash compactor distinctly
marked to identify it as protected by a system of double insu-
lation, or its equivalent, shall not be required to be terminated
with a grounding-type attachment plug.
(2) The length of the cord shall be 0.9 m to 1.2 m (3 ft to
4 ft) measured from the face of the attachment plug to
the plane of the rear of the appliance.
(3) Receptacles shall be located to avoid physical damage
to the ﬂexible cord.
(4) The receptacle shall be located in the space occupied
by the appliance or adjacent thereto.
(5) The receptacle shall be accessible.

Magnettica · 07-13-2009, 03:37 PM

Or....

Quote:

422.31 Disconnection of Permanently Connected Appli-
ances.

(A) Rated at Not Over 300 Volt-Amperes or 1⁄8 Horse-
power. For permanently connected appliances rated at not
over 300 volt-amperes or 1⁄8 hp, the branch-circuit overcurrent
device shall be permitted to serve as the disconnecting means.
(B) Appliances Rated Over 300 Volt-Amperes or
1 ⁄ 8 Horsepower. For permanently connected appliances
rated over 300 volt-amperes or 1⁄8 hp, the branch-circuit
switch or circuit breaker shall be permitted to serve as the
disconnecting means where the switch or circuit breaker is
within sight from the appliance or is capable of being
locked in the open position. The provision for locking or
adding a lock to the disconnecting means shall be installed
on or at the switch or circuit breaker used as the discon-
necting means and shall remain in place with or without the
lock installed.
FPN: For appliances employing unit switches, see 422.34.

Toronto Sparky · 07-13-2009, 04:28 PM

Hmmmm I have never direct wired a dishwasher. Plug seems logical to me. (Not as a disconnecting means but just to make it easier)
That would be like direct wiring the stove or a dryer like we used to way back. Sure those cords are not a considered a disconnecting means.

Magnettica · 07-13-2009, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toronto Sparky

Hmmmm I have never direct wired a dishwasher. Plug seems logical to me. (Not as a disconnecting means but just to make it easier)
That would be like direct wiring the stove or a dryer like we used to way back. Sure those cords are not a considered a disconnecting means.

I'm away from my desk but I am certain that the same rules apply for electric ovens too. Not sure if they apply to electric dryers though.

steelersman · 07-13-2009, 05:33 PM

I've wired hundreds of dishwashers and disposals and not a single one had a cord on it and I never installed a cord. Always hardwired them and installed a breaker lock-off for dishwasher. That's how it's done around these parts. Dryers and Ranges and the like of course always get a cord and plug.

MDShunk · 07-13-2009, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captkirk

I thought i was doing right by installing cords so you can use it as the disconnect. He told me you have to install a breaker lock instead. And I know what article he is refering to but to say that a certain dishwasher is not rated to have a cord is a little bit of a strech for me.

Yeah, as pointed out, he's dead wrong on that one. If he wants to be real picky, he can make you use the manufacturer's cord. I get them here from GE, since 75% of the dishwashers out there are made by GE in the first place (no matter whose name is on the outside): http://hdsupplysolutions.com/webapp/...3-1&req=search

There are still a fair amount of dishwashers with a marked 'off' position on the timer, so that qualifies too.

william1978 · 07-13-2009, 06:29 PM

Sounds like you have you a good inspector. There are a few like that down here also.

Kevin J · 07-13-2009, 08:16 PM

I have installed some Meile (hope I spelled that correctly) dishwasher units and drawers that came from the factory with cords. I order appliance rated cords from the supply house all the time. Use them on dishwashers, disposals, etc.

cmac1 · 07-13-2009, 09:53 PM

define northern nj,i just finished a job in cranbury and this was unbelievably tough

chenley · 07-13-2009, 11:19 PM

I have always hardwired dishwashers. Mostly use a DP 20A breaker, use one leg for the switched garbage disposal and the other leg for the dishwasher.

captkirk · 07-14-2009, 07:59 AM

I personally dont have a preferance either way. I would just like to know why you cant put a cord on it...? Does the manufacurer have to tell you its ok..? FWIW its easier to just hard wire and install a breaker lock how many times are they really going to have to move one...? But, whatever...

JES2727 · 07-14-2009, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac1

define northern nj,i just finished a job in cranbury and this was unbelievably tough

Cranbury is in Central Jersey. But mostly just residents of Central Jersey recognize it as a separate region. To everyone else it seems there's only North Jersey and South Jersey.
Cranbury is around the corner from me. Stop by and say Hi next time you're here!

captkirk · 07-14-2009, 09:46 PM

Hey Ill be in Cranford on Fri ......lets do lunch...

JES2727 · 07-15-2009, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captkirk

Hey Ill be in Cranford on Fri ......lets do lunch...

That's the wrong Cran