any open shops convert to union lately? - Page 3 - Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum

nap · 01-26-2008, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by liverstos

According to my former home local agreement, to sign book 1, an electrician has to have residence in the local jurisdiction, have worked 2000 hours in the local during the last four years, and have either served an apprenticeship, or meet the work hours requirements to obtain JW status. As I no longer lived in the area, and had not worked there for over four years, I was told by the office staff that I could no longer sign book one.

My local does someting similar. Can't remember all the specifics though but if you work in another local, the hours requirement is all but removed. It is basically so guys don;t work somewhere other than a signatory employer and remain on the book.

So, what were the requirements for getting on book 1 in the area you lived in?

oldman · 01-27-2008, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tpr

you sound like your remotely interested in learning about it . just call the local in your area. you can be annonymous , just ask questions.

Brian John, this is why we have these posts...this here is information that most guys who have never been in the union don't know.

Now, if you are in a local with a good BA, you have a shot...if your locals BA is not so nice to those who didn't come up through the IBEW, not so much of a shot...

but it's definitely worth the phone call to get some info...

oldman · 01-27-2008, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randomkiller

Your right about that. The company that took over the one I work for is pretty large. I can't believe all the stuff in the monthly newsletter. They have jobs worldwide and run an open jobs bulletin board that has some nice places to go with plenty of variety.

random, you're killing my curiosity...who bought your company?

Celtic · 01-27-2008, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldman

random, you're killing my curiosity...who bought your company?

I'm going with Emcor

oldman · 01-27-2008, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celtic

I'm going with Emcor

that was my thought too...or possibly Carrier (they bought out Fairfield Refrigeration a few years back)...

randomkiller · 01-27-2008, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldman

random, you're killing my curiosity...who bought your company?

It's a subsidiary of Emcorgroup, I thought I had said before at somepoint. They bought us out a while ago and just put some of their people in the first week of the year.

brian john · 01-27-2008, 07:38 PM

Emcor has bought 4 or 5 shops in our area.

randomkiller · 01-27-2008, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brian john

Emcor has bought 4 or 5 shops in our area.

Same here, two of the shops we have been working with and a another one more north.

oldman · 01-27-2008, 07:47 PM

they have been growing pretty quick of the past few years...does explain the increase in Emcor trucks in the area...prior, they had been mostly north of here...

Celtic · 01-28-2008, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randomkiller

It's a subsidiary of Emcorgroup, ...

I dunno if you did?

Emcor seems the only player with any money left for "acquisitions and mergers"

LawnGuyLandSparky · 01-28-2008, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldman

not necessarily...we had a guy working for us a few years back that got into the union down in North Carolina...he was originally from NJ, and moved back here after a divorce...so while he may have been on book one in NC, here in NJ he was a traveler and relegated to book 2...so, he got tired of signing in every week for nothing and came to work for us...

OK color me stupid but, he HAS to be book 1 somewhere. Has to be in order to be book 2 somewhere else. If not, he's just book 3 or 4. Maybe an organized hand in one local, and immediately travelled somewhere else and signed book 2 before he met the minimum work requirements.

Celtic · 01-28-2008, 07:52 PM

Book 3....Book 4?

Maybe in the JIB....but no where else I've ever heard of.

If he got organized and didn't meet the requirements (through, schooling, OJT, testing, etc) he would never have been issued a card....and speaking of cards, the home local wouldn't send him a dues receipt w/o the classification being completed.

No dues receipt = no work.

oldman · 01-28-2008, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LawnGuyLandSparky

OK color me stupid but, he HAS to be book 1 somewhere. Has to be in order to be book 2 somewhere else. If not, he's just book 3 or 4. Maybe an organized hand in one local, and immediately travelled somewhere else and signed book 2 before he met the minimum work requirements.

i've already answered this...

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldman

not necessarily...we had a guy working for us a few years back that got into the union down in North Carolina...he was originally from NJ, and moved back here after a divorce...so while he may have been on book one in NC, here in NJ he was a traveler and relegated to book 2...so, he got tired of signing in every week for nothing and came to work for us...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celtic

He was still Book I...but back in NC, not NJ.

Book I applies to your "home" local...once you pass it's borders and sign a book elsewhere ~ it's Book II.

faber307 · 01-30-2008, 07:28 PM

I vote union members be aloud to perform all the residential side work they want. (in my state)

I just don't see the ibew getting enough residential market share to keep these guys from it.

Everybody knows somebody and is looking for someone to work for cash.

I used to moonlight for extra fun money.
Let those young guys go after it.
And for the guys laid off for extended periods, some rope work for cash probably sounds pretty good.

Commercial and Industrial? The local has to draw the line somewhere.

oldman · 01-30-2008, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tab Faber

I vote union members be aloud to perform all the residential side work they want. (in my state)

I just don't see the ibew getting enough residential market share to keep these guys from it.

Everybody knows somebody and is looking for someone to work for cash.

I used to moonlight for extra fun money.
Let those young guys go after it.
And for the guys laid off for extended periods, some rope work for cash probably sounds pretty good.

Commercial and Industrial? The local has to draw the line somewhere.

so basically "screw every contractor who isn't a large commercial/industrial union outfit"? ok, fair enough..

Celtic · 01-30-2008, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tab Faber

I vote union members be aloud to perform all the residential side work they want. (in my state)

I didn't know it was up for a vote (in your State or any another State)?
BTW, just what State are you in?
Many States have laws that have to do with licensing, insurance, bonding, CE credits/classes, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tab Faber

I just don't see the ibew getting enough residential market share to keep these guys from it.

...and just why is that?
Does your local have a residential division?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tab Faber

Everybody knows somebody and is looking for someone to work for cash.

I used to moonlight for extra fun money.
Let those young guys go after it.
And for the guys laid off for extended periods, some rope work for cash probably sounds pretty good.

Just because everyone knows someone and cash sounds good - it might just be illegal ...I know what you purpose IS illegal in NJ.

MechanicalDVR · 01-31-2008, 09:25 AM

How does it work with the IBEW for guys that hold a NJ license and work out of the hall? Several of the new guys that work with us now hold their own licenses. Do they just hold the license and not get a bond and work permit, or is the bond a requirment for the license? Just wondering.

Celtic · 01-31-2008, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MechanicalDVR

How does it work with the IBEW for guys that hold a NJ license and work out of the hall?

The local doesn't care if you get a electrical license(EL) or not - they DO care if you obtain a business permit(BP). Having the BP would allow you to be a "bona fide" Electrical Contractor (EC)...thus competing with the signatory ECs.
NJ has one flavor of EC which allows the holder to contract work in any occupancy from a SFH to a nuke plant.

One of the agreements YOU make with the IBEW as a member is that "you will not engage in the business of electrical contracting" ~ maybe not the exact wording, but close enough ...and I believe it is category 1 language. Which goes back to the bit about competing with the sig. ECs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MechanicalDVR

Several of the new guys that work with us now hold their own licenses. Do they just hold the license and not get a bond and work permit, or is the bond a requirment for the license? Just wondering.

The EL is just a license - which allows you to do NO work.
To be an an EC, you need the EL, BP, ins., bonding, etc. which would allow you to contract for work.

LawnGuyLandSparky · 01-31-2008, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tab Faber

I vote union members be aloud to perform all the residential side work they want. (in my state)

I just don't see the ibew getting enough residential market share to keep these guys from it.

Everybody knows somebody and is looking for someone to work for cash.

I used to moonlight for extra fun money.
Let those young guys go after it.
And for the guys laid off for extended periods, some rope work for cash probably sounds pretty good.

Commercial and Industrial? The local has to draw the line somewhere.

I agree, in jurisdictions where the IBEW doesn't have any appreciable residential marketshare, it should allow it's members to do this work legitimately.

InControl · 02-04-2008, 01:32 AM

Caught behind a rock and a hard place...

The union wants you to follow there rules...NO SIDE WORK!

Non-union wants you to follow there rules...NO SIDE WORK!

Because, as we all know, all side work will ultimately result in a family dwelling burning down, and all residents will die a fiery death.

Hack electricians are working everywhere, look out your window, you will probably see many houses burning down as we speak.

Lets be honest with our selves here......It doesn't take a rocket scientist to wire a house. You could train an orangutan to do it. I'm sure i'll get flamed for that comment, but seriously, is it that difficult?

So who should we rely on as far as regulation? If I want to add a bathroom to a house that I just bought, can I do it myself? or do I need a 'government' supplied contractor that has 'payed his dues' and now is qualified to work on my plumbing.

My point being, that as a free society, that which we have enjoyed thus far......be careful what you ask for, because it just may come true......