Help with a Delta Electronics VFD-B - Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum

sparkytwig · 10-31-2010, 05:15 PM

Manual at: http://www.delta.com.tw/product/em/d..._manual_en.pdf

I have a Delta Electornic VFD-B drive. I have the 3-wire Stop/Start and FWD/REV figuered out using NO for run,NC for stop and 3 position sl sw for FWD/REV just like the drawing on page 5-19. My issue is this drive will be installed on an inclined convyer with a external brake so when it stops it doesnt rollback. There will be people working right on the line so needless to say they will be starting and stopping it. Now I want to use one of the multi-function inputs for a one step speed control, but I feel if I install a on-off selector sw for this someone will forget it is engaged and start it with it on. What is the best way to wire a NO momentary sw and still maintain the input when pressed? If I use a 24V relay in the input circuit do I need a diode across the coil? Also I have never worked with an external DC motor Brake but it looks pretty straight forward. I'm just using existing brake already installed in the field any advice?

Jlarson · 10-31-2010, 11:47 PM

Gawd the user's manual is like 5 MB's, WTF?

varmit · 11-01-2010, 05:49 AM

If this drive has a NO contact output (most do) then run whatever control power that you have through this contact to a relay rated to handle the brake coil load. Program the contact output to close on "drive running". Almost all motor mounted brakes are energize to release.

I am assuming that you know that the brake CAN NOT be powered from the drive output to the motor.

John Valdes · 11-01-2010, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparkytwig

Manual at: http://www.delta.com.tw/product/em/d..._manual_en.pdf

I have a Delta Electornic VFD-B drive. I have the 3-wire Stop/Start and FWD/REV figuered out using NO for run,NC for stop and 3 position sl sw for FWD/REV just like the drawing on page 5-19. My issue is this drive will be installed on an inclined convyer with a external brake so when it stops it doesnt rollback.

If you are using a brake motor and VFD, you must separate the VFD output from the brake. The brake needs it own power supply and can be energized and de-energized from a drive output.

There will be people working right on the line so needless to say they will be starting and stopping it. Now I want to use one of the multi-function inputs for a one step speed control, but I feel if I install a on-off selector sw for this someone will forget it is engaged and start it with it on.

I am not certain what you mean by this? Of course you can use a preset speed via contact closure. The drive can be programmed to start with another input (start). The preset speed can be jumped in the drive panel if you want, so no one can mess with it.
Just give them access to stop/start and you keep control of the speed.

What is the best way to wire a NO momentary sw and still maintain the input when pressed? If I use a 24V relay in the input circuit do I need a diode across the coil? Also I have never worked with an external DC motor Brake but it looks pretty straight forward. I'm just using existing brake already installed in the field any advice?

The drive is programmed to either 2 or 3 wire control. In 2 wire control, when the input is closed it's not maintained. Its like jog. In 3 wire control, when the input is closed, it stays closed without any further requirement. That's the difference between 2 wire and 3 wire control.

Physically jumper the preset speed you require. Then all you need is a stop/start switch for the operators.

Hunter1151 · 11-04-2010, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by varmit

If this drive has a NO contact output (most do) then run whatever control power that you have through this contact to a relay rated to handle the brake coil load. Program the contact output to close on "drive running". Almost all motor mounted brakes are energize to release.

I am assuming that you know that the brake CAN NOT be powered from the drive output to the motor.

Most brakes are wired as a fail safe, wire your contractor control to RC and RA, N.O., then set 03-00 to 1 ac drive operational, when drive is operating the contractor will energize releasing the brake, set the drive to coast to stop or you will get a dc bus over voltage when you stop

John Valdes · 11-05-2010, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter1151

Most brakes are wired as a fail safe, wire your contractor control to RC and RA, N.O., then set 03-00 to 1 ac drive operational, when drive is operating the contractor will energize releasing the brake, set the drive to coast to stop or you will get a dc bus over voltage when you stop

Now, lets try that again in English. RC? RA? 03-00? 1 ac drive? contractor?

Hunter1151 · 11-05-2010, 12:50 PM

this drive has a single pole double throw form C Relay, We will control the holding break with a contactor, assume 120V coil, we can wire to the terminals on the drive RC, this is the common side of the form C Relay, then to RA, this is the switched side of the Form C Relay.

Now we will program the drive to close that relay when the drive is operational. Under Group 3 Output Function Parameters (03) we can then goto Multi Function Output Relay Setting (00) so the parameter you need is 03-00, Set this to 01 - AC Drive Operational. So when the drive gets a command to start, the relay will change stated energizing the coil applying power to the dreak and releasing it, if the drive faults or is shut off the relay will open denergizing the contactor coil, removing power from the break and now it is holding.

John Valdes · 11-05-2010, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter1151

this drive has a single pole double throw form C Relay, We will control the holding break with a contactor, assume 120V coil, we can wire to the terminals on the drive RC, this is the common side of the form C Relay, then to RA, this is the switched side of the Form C Relay.

Now we will program the drive to close that relay when the drive is operational. Under Group 3 Output Function Parameters (03) we can then goto Multi Function Output Relay Setting (00) so the parameter you need is 03-00, Set this to 01 - AC Drive Operational. So when the drive gets a command to start, the relay will change stated energizing the coil applying power to the dreak and releasing it, if the drive faults or is shut off the relay will open denergizing the contactor coil, removing power from the break and now it is holding.

I have a better idea.
Turn brake on when drive is in stop mode. Turn brake off when drive is in run mode. We do this with a drive output for control and we use a DC supply for the brake. How about that!

Hunter1151 · 11-05-2010, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Valdes

I have a better idea.
Turn brake on when drive is in stop mode. Turn brake off when drive is in run mode. We do this with a drive output for control and we use a DC supply for the brake. How about that!

Not good, what is the supply to the brake, most are line voltage, so you need a relay, the digital outputs on the drive have a low current limit I think like 200mA, so the in rush of the coil can make the output fail using the form C relay is better because you can do 5A threw the relay which is closer to handle the inrush of a coil. Why is it you choose to question response? I have been using delta drives for better than 10 years.

John Valdes · 11-06-2010, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter1151

Not good, what is the supply to the brake, most are line voltage, so you need a relay, the digital outputs on the drive have a low current limit I think like 200mA, so the in rush of the coil can make the output fail using the form C relay is better because you can do 5A threw the relay which is closer to handle the inrush of a coil. Why is it you choose to question response? I have been using delta drives for better than 10 years.

He said it was a DC brake motor. Now what would you have assumed the brake was?
Look, if you quit being so complicated, I said exactly what you said, I just used fewer words on purpose. Just for you.

Hunter1151 · 11-06-2010, 02:55 PM

Don't need fewer words for me, I understand the process and hardware, if he uses a digital out like you are saying he will burn up the output. I have been doing industrial automation for 20+ years, and have engineered several applications for many processes, so you need not to be so rude as if you know better than anyone, I thought this forum was something everyone could learn from each others experiences, but it seems it's a pissing contest when amateurs as yourself try to act as if you know, show respect and stop being an asshole