B W E

"where branch circuit WIRING is modified...." how is replacing a receptacle modifying wiring? Let's say it's a dead end box with a hot and a neutral. You take off the old receptacle, put on a three prong. How has the WIRING been modified? A device is not "wiring".

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

BBQ

Receptacles do not have prongs, next week we will go over the differences between girls and boys.






You are not really and electrician are you?

Chris1971

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Chris1971

Still a modification, IMO.

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B W E

You're wrong, IMO.

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

Salvatoreg02

Hey if you wanna change it, so be it

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Sal
P.E.S

Chris1971

Oh crap!!! I thought I was logged into plumbertalk.com

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Chris1971

Maybe, maybe not.

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B W E

Maybe ...... Here's what Minnesota has to say about it.... I'm sure many other states have the same mindset. Will find more later....

443 Lafayette Road North St. Paul, Minnesota 55155 www.dli.mn.govw www.electricity.state.mn.us
(651) 284-5064 1-800-DIAL-DLI Fax: (651) 284-5743 TTY: (651) 297-4198
2011 National Electrical Code® Questions & Answers
1. Will the replacement of a residential panelboard be considered a “circuit modification” and
prompt the new requirement in 210.12 for AFCI protection of existing branch circuits?
201.12(B) Branch Circuit Extensions or Modifications — Dwelling Units. In any of the areas specified in 210.12(A), where branch-circuit wiring is modified, replaced, or extended, the branch circuit shall be protected by one of the following:
(1) A listed combination-type AFCI located at the origin of the branch circuit
(2) A listed outlet branch-circuit type AFCI located at the first receptacle outlet of the
existing branch circuit
This change requires a branch circuit to have combination‐type AFCI protection when there is an extension or modification. “Branch circuit” is defined in Article 100 as “The circuit conductors between the final overcurrent device protecting the circuit and the outlet(s).” The overcurrent device is not part of the branch circuit and replacing the circuit breaker is not a modification of the branch circuit.
Answer: When the conductors of an existing branch circuit are disconnected from an overcurrent device in an existing panelboard and simply re‐terminated on a new overcurrent device in a new panelboard, the branch circuit wiring has not been modified or extended, therefore AFCI protection would not be required.
The US Consumer Product Safety Commission, CCPC, states “Although the requirement is limited to certain circuits in new residential construction, AFCIs should be considered for added protection in other circuits and for existing homes, as well. Older homes with aging and deteriorating wiring systems can especially benefit from the added protection of AFCIs. AFCIs should also be considered whenever adding or upgrading a panel box while using existing branch circuit conductors.”

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

BBQ

There is no one answer for this, it is entirely a local call and real waste of time to argue about on a national level.

B W E

Just called my local building and safety and spoke to inspector. Replacing a device is considered "maintenance" and does not constitute a "modification" that would require the installation of an arc fault device. I also asked about this issue, replacing ungrounded receptacles with grounded receptacles, and installing a GFI at the beginning of the circuit and he said "nope, that's maintenance. No arc fault required.". However, I suppose that could differ with every AHJ.

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

Chris1971

Can we still argue this point?

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Cletis

I like Maintainance and Existing. Those are two great words

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www.cletiselectric.com

B W E

There's no argument as far as I'm concerned. I won't be putting in Arc Faults when I replace receptacles. You can.

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

Chris1971

Yeah, not by choice on my end.

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B W E

It is your choice. You choose to interpret the code incorrectly and mistakenly assign definitions to things contrary to the NEC. Call your ahj and ask them. If I'm wrong, I'll send you a gift certificate for see's candy

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

electrictim510

For arguments sake; what if you pigtail the connections when you replace the receptacle? I do this anytime I touch a plug...

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"Understand one thing every one has a place in this trade, and no matter what your skill set I doubt you know it all." brian john

Chris1971

Sounds like you modified the wiring of the branch circuit. Good point.

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B W E

The branch circuit conductors were not extended to another location to perform another function. I'm beginning to think you're not serious, and are just curious to see what kind of arguing endurance I have....

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Amazing love, how can it be, that you, my King, would die for me?

Chris1971

AHJ requires it in one municipality.

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