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05-04-2012, 11:55 AM
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#21
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 201
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Sorry guys.I was wrong, there is no shared neutral on this floor. we've been here a couple hours troubleshooting and not really getting anywhere. and I might not be able to explain this well enough for all of you to understand Me.
But he's starting to think it might be unavoidable, that it might be something that the batteries just make happen. he's getting up to 50 volts on the neutral with switch off... I dunno he's starting to get really complex with his theories. Sorry I can't explain better guys...
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05-04-2012, 12:39 PM
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#22
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Conservitum Americum
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2,794
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Time for some old school wire tracing.
__________________
There are 10 types of people.
Those who understand binary and those who don't.
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05-04-2012, 12:44 PM
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#23
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: vida
Posts: 229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ontariojer
Mwbc. Picking up another Phase/leg through another load.
You're welcome.
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That would put 480 on the ballasts and smoke the whole row, likely.
Mark
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05-04-2012, 12:56 PM
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#24
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1,000,000th Poster
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Portland
Posts: 9,407
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I have a sneaking suspicion that whatever's causing this is not that complex, it's simply wired wrong.
-John
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05-04-2012, 01:26 PM
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#25
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Registered Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: the heartland
Posts: 659
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do these fixtures have emergency back up ballasts? are they turning on at full capacity or a diminished capacity?
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05-04-2012, 08:05 PM
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#26
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 201
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by D-Bo
do these fixtures have emergency back up ballasts? are they turning on at full capacity or a diminished capacity?
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Its 2 rows of 5 strip lights on one switch. The middle fixture in each row is the emergency. It just has a battery back up. You wouldn't know anything was wrong until u broke the neutral with the switch off. That's when the regular fixtures kick on. and I didn't know this til I got there but its just one regular light in each row that kicks on and it'll either light one tube fully or both tubes will flicker. night lights work just fine. But I realized pretty quickly that it's going to be way over my head,I just don't have enough experience.
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05-04-2012, 08:09 PM
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#27
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 201
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Big John
I have a sneaking suspicion that whatever's causing this is not that complex, it's simply wired wrong.
-John
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That's what I thought, but we got to the point where we just opened every fixture, every junction box , switch box-everything is wired correctly for sure now.
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05-04-2012, 08:14 PM
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#28
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 201
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Also, when the switch is on, and neutral is lifted, lights do turn off.
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05-04-2012, 08:18 PM
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#29
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth Australia
Posts: 135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oww-is-that-hot?
.he's getting up to 50 volts on the neutral with switch off...
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Is he using a high impedance digital multimetre? If so that would be a capacitance or inductance he's seeing, also commonly refered to as "ghost voltages" If he used a low impedance metre that 50 volt's would disappear...
It's deffinently starting to sound like these lights are wired incorrectly.... and that shared neutral might also be worth investigating..
Never mind just re-read no shared neutral don't worry about then..
Last edited by Aussielec; 05-04-2012 at 08:24 PM.
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05-04-2012, 08:26 PM
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#30
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth Australia
Posts: 135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oww-is-that-hot?
Its 2 rows of 5 strip lights on one switch. The middle fixture in each row is the emergency. It just has a battery back up. You wouldn't know anything was wrong until u broke the neutral with the switch off. That's when the regular fixtures kick on. and I didn't know this til I got there but its just one regular light in each row that kicks on and it'll either light one tube fully or both tubes will flicker. night lights work just fine. But I realized pretty quickly that it's going to be way over my head,I just don't have enough experience.
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Yup, sounds like the lights are backfeeding through somewhere when he disconnects the neutral......wired wrong..
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05-04-2012, 08:39 PM
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#31
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1,000,000th Poster
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Portland
Posts: 9,407
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Are the emergency lights on the same circuit?
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05-04-2012, 09:57 PM
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#32
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Registered Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: the heartland
Posts: 659
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are the lights continuous row mounted or connected by metal conduit?
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05-04-2012, 10:48 PM
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#33
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Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 47
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Swap the neutral for the night light circuit with the neutral for the remaining lights.
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05-04-2012, 10:56 PM
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#34
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Registered Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: the heartland
Posts: 659
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its probably the same neutral, should be anyway
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05-04-2012, 11:03 PM
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#35
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This amp goes to 11
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 643
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I'm thinking the wiring is confused with the night lights and when the neutral is broken the e-lights are trying to fire all the lights in the row. Are the fixtures all butt to butt with wire pulled through all the fixtures? And are the e-lights battery backup?
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05-04-2012, 11:16 PM
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#36
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This amp goes to 11
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 643
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When power is cut ie: breaking the neutral, its like the power is out so e-lights are turning on and if they are battery backup and trying to light all the lights then you'll get flickering and half light lights. Just a guess but maybe the constant feed for the e-lights and the switching for main lights are confused.
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05-04-2012, 11:20 PM
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#37
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Registered Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: the heartland
Posts: 659
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thats what i was driving at. more than once ive seen emergency ballast fixtures come from the factory with the wiring completely ass backwards and needing to be redone
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05-04-2012, 11:24 PM
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#38
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This amp goes to 11
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 643
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Confucius says find e-light cut sheets. Make sure all wires on ballast are connected correctly. Pray to Budda, then turn on power! Don't forget inscents and candles!!
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05-04-2012, 11:32 PM
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#39
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Registered Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: the heartland
Posts: 659
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and the virgins, don't forget the virgins
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05-05-2012, 06:07 AM
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#40
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Not here at the moment
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Not in Jersey
Posts: 3,466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oww-is-that-hot?
Sorry guys.I was wrong, there is no shared neutral on this floor. we've been here a couple hours troubleshooting and not really getting anywhere. and I might not be able to explain this well enough for all of you to understand Me.
But he's starting to think it might be unavoidable, that it might be something that the batteries just make happen. he's getting up to 50 volts on the neutral with switch off... I dunno he's starting to get really complex with his theories. Sorry I can't explain better guys...
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T-shooting this for a couple of hours and not getting anywhere ?????????????
Fire that J-man. If he can't t-shoot a light circuit in 20 minutes, he needs to work a Happy Jacks flipping burgers, not wiring inside buildings.
Ask your boss if you can work with someone else, that guy your working with is a loser.
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