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05-02-2012, 08:19 PM
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#1
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 116
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2012 Code changes
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The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Handasee For This Useful Post:
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05-02-2012, 09:12 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: victoria bc, canada
Posts: 136
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yeah thats the BC safety authority, they are having a course next week where I live about this, and i plan to attend. Looks like you got my course reading material before me haha
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05-02-2012, 11:04 PM
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#3
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Junior Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Ontario Canada
Posts: 7
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05-02-2012, 11:07 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Regina, Sask, Canada
Posts: 525
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Page 19 of the pdf, at the diagram where it refers to Rule 4004(3) "fluorescent lighting loads": Where does that come from? Is that a BC amendment? Is there a list of other loads or is it just fluorescents? Some ballasts have a power factor of 98% and a thd of less than 10%. That's pretty good. How good does it have to be to not influence the current on the neutral?
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05-04-2012, 01:42 AM
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#5
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Vancouver bc
Posts: 4
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I see table two has changed quite a lot, interesting though #14 awg is good for 20A but then when you read it directs you to section 14 which says max breaker for #14 is still a 15A breaker.
The other interesting one is I see we will be allowed to mount panels outside like the Americans.
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05-04-2012, 01:51 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Kamloops BC
Posts: 556
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I wonder if they will have the Handouts at the tech talks, that is a lot of printing ,I was sent 6 links of PDF's
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#Knowthecode2012 #NESM
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05-04-2012, 09:41 AM
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#7
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Gillam, Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xlink
Page 19 of the pdf, at the diagram where it refers to Rule 4004(3) "fluorescent lighting loads": Where does that come from? Is that a BC amendment? Is there a list of other loads or is it just fluorescents? Some ballasts have a power factor of 98% and a thd of less than 10%. That's pretty good. How good does it have to be to not influence the current on the neutral?
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Switching power supplies, like high frequency ballasts and computers, caouse a lot of 3rd harmonic distortions. Those cause neutral currents to be additive and can typically cause currents 1.732 x higher.
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05-04-2012, 10:32 AM
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#8
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Gillam, Manitoba, Canada
Posts: 35
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This handout is very nice, but I have found 2 mistakes already and I am not even through the first of the 4 booklets.
When you are going through it have your 2012 book open at the rule at the same time to see the errors.
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05-04-2012, 11:36 AM
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#9
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Eeeeeevil Bitch
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Port Coquitlam, British Columbia
Posts: 2,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brd-GTI
I see table two has changed quite a lot, interesting though #14 awg is good for 20A but then when you read it directs you to section 14 which says max breaker for #14 is still a 15A breaker.
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I read that too............kinda stupid, almost a what was the point kind of change. *bangs head on table*  Im sure it has it's uses but not in most applications.
Curious if this is going to remain or if it will just annoy enough until the switch it back in the next cycle.
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05-04-2012, 05:33 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Commy Canada
Posts: 802
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCSparkyGirl
I read that too............kinda stupid, almost a what was the point kind of change. *bangs head on table* Im sure it has it's uses but not in most applications.
Curious if this is going to remain or if it will just annoy enough until the switch it back in the next cycle. |
For the purpose of derateing this change is huge 
Old book after 6 #12s in a pipe your not even good for 15A. Now with it bumped up you can have 24 #12s in a pipe and still be good for 15A
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The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to randas For This Useful Post:
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05-04-2012, 08:29 PM
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#11
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 251
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I am so used to having #12 in the spec book and that is what I am used to pulling. I am curious if this will get relaxed and we can start using #14 in pipe.
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05-04-2012, 09:14 PM
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#12
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Vancouver bc
Posts: 4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randas
For the purpose of derateing this change is huge
Old book after 6 #12s in a pipe your not even good for 15A. Now with it bumped up you can have 24 #12s in a pipe and still be good for 15A |
Yeh after reading the rule over a couple times for the fact of de-rating its huge, we usually have to pull a couple #12 and #10/2 through a pipe for the 20A kitchen counter plugs but once in effect I can pull #12 instead
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05-04-2012, 09:53 PM
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#13
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Eeeeeevil Bitch
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Port Coquitlam, British Columbia
Posts: 2,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randas
For the purpose of derateing this change is huge
Old book after 6 #12s in a pipe your not even good for 15A. Now with it bumped up you can have 24 #12s in a pipe and still be good for 15A |
AH true that..........Thank goodness I talk to you guys. Being off the job for a year....Im losing my game...  
fack.....has the new code changes been officially adopted yet? I have to get in to write my FSR, and I have been badly procrastinating. 
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05-04-2012, 10:42 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Durham, NC
Posts: 795
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Cool, I realized after a downloaded and saved that it's not my Code EH!
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If your even thirsty, your two quarts low.
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05-05-2012, 12:58 AM
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#15
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Vancouver bc
Posts: 4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BCSparkyGirl
AH true that..........Thank goodness I talk to you guys. Being off the job for a year....Im losing my game...
fack.....has the new code changes been officially adopted yet? I have to get in to write my FSR, and I have been badly procrastinating. |
I asked a couple inspectors about when its going to be adopted and they figure around sept
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05-05-2012, 04:39 AM
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#16
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Eeeeeevil Bitch
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Port Coquitlam, British Columbia
Posts: 2,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brd-GTI
I asked a couple inspectors about when its going to be adopted and they figure around sept
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Thanks man, I had better get my ass to the SA....I am the WORST procrastinator.......of course, having another kid didn't help matters.
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05-06-2012, 04:45 PM
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#17
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: victoria bc, canada
Posts: 136
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Yeah i guess they had to "create" changes in order to sell their new code book. Last time around there was almost a civil uprising because that code barely had any significant changes and we had to go buy it
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05-06-2012, 10:23 PM
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#18
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 5
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I'm in school right now as part of the first intake in MB to use the 2012 code book, and our code instructor said that the changes to Table 2 are pretty much only for ampacity derating in pipe (as some others have pointed out). For normal use, 14-104 limits #14 to 15A breakers, #12 to 20A and #10 to 30A. Also, 4-006 says to use the temperature column of Table 2 for the temp rating of the wire or the equipment it's connected to, whichever is lower. Means residential wiring is going to usually use the 75 degree column instead of the 90.
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05-07-2012, 12:45 PM
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#19
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Victoria BC Canada
Posts: 408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brd-GTI
I see table two has changed quite a lot, interesting though #14 awg is good for 20A but then when you read it directs you to section 14 which says max breaker for #14 is still a 15A breaker.
The other interesting one is I see we will be allowed to mount panels outside like the Americans.
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No the rule does not allow the Panel to be outside. Only the main service entry switch whether fused or a breaker. Further be darn careful about applying the rules as you might get a question like is the main overcurrent protection temperature compensated for temperatures below 10 degrees?
So we are often challenged to get service conductors far enough inside of a house to place panels in better locations than outside walls or someone is adding a suite or ?
What it really amounts to is you will be able to put the main outside and add a combo panel inside
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05-09-2012, 01:42 AM
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#20
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: victoria bc, canada
Posts: 136
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So tonight I attended the first province course on the new code 2012 changes, here in victoria bc. It was 4 hours long and there will be another 4 hour long course on thursday. For those who wonder if they should attend the new course in your area, I totally recommend it. Not only does it fullfil a FSR requirement course to continue holding your liscence, but some of the changes were explained very well and it made more sense than just reading the handout.
One of my favorite changes is that we can now run Ac90 or teck cable in pvc pipe (which im sure many were doing already) and CSA now lets you.
Also ive discovered they have a plug assembly that the code allows you to use without having a box to support it, Im gonna have to find out the pricing on that.
They also now ask you to use a specific octogon box for fan support, as well as other support requirement which i think is a good change.
just the bonding and grounding section was worth attending the course, since its always so damn confusing.
Sure there are a few ******ed changes as usual, but thankfully they really don't cause too much of a headache
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