Speedy Petey

I understand that Roger, but WHY does it have to be that way?
I do NOT accept the old "It's the way we do things" B-S.

They know no one will fight them for fear of the job being delayed. This is just plain wrong, and is probably criminal to certain slight extent.

I guess I am lucky that I can "ask" for a reference and they'll read it with me and explain their point. The inspectors I use aren't on power trips.
This may be because we use third party inspectors and we can use any of several different agencies. The field guys also usually have to answer to higher ups. And the higher ups are typically very cool and will talk with you.

I have to admit. There are some local municipal building inspectors around here who are not this easy to deal with. One is downright vindictive.

JohnJ0906

That's all we have around here. Most ARE professional, and were electricians in the field before becoming inspectors, but not all. As you can see by the link, SOME actually have things in writing, but some jurisdictions don't want to make it easy.
I don't care (too much) what the requirements are, as long as it's official, in writing, enforced across-the-board, and we know about it in advance.

__________________
John from Baltimore
"One day at a Time"
All responses based on the '08 NEC
It's not my fault, it's not my problem, I'm not your solution.

Speedy Petey

BAM!
All that writing for me and you summed it up in one concise sentence!

480sparky

Let me ask you all something:

If you were driving through a city, and the speed limit was posted at 45MPH, and you were doing 45, say the city cop pulls you over.

He gives you a ticket for doing 45. You would say, "But the speed limit is 45, how can I be speeding?", right?

If the cop says, "Well, I say it's 35 today, so here's your ticket....have a nice day.", you would make a beeline to the police station, city hall, your court date, wherever you need to go, because no police officer has the legal power to change the written law.

Same legal principle applies to inspectors. They are inspectors, not expectors.

__________________
WWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhh!

Roger123

I agree Ken, but there is no GC in your example with his arms folded saying, "just get this job done now, whatever it takes!"

Idaho Abe

I am an inspector and if a EC questions my decision I encourage them all to aks me where it is in the NEC. If I cannot find it I am wrong. All inspectors get into their favorite things and sometimes try to enforce what they think the code should be not what it is. Good Luck

Speedy Petey

Abe, thank you VERY much for these frank statements. It is refreshing to see this.

brian john

I care, some things are not worth arguing, but I spent a long time studying and figuring out what little I know and I do not take kindly to inspectors, electricians or engineers that make up your own code. Don't explain HOO-DOO VOO-DOO theory to me and tell my that the way it is if it isn't.

Roger123

Ditto!

kapakahi

I am an electrician for many years now. I hold several licenses and I am now also working a bit as an inspector. (I passed all three tests for national certification) In New York State it can be pretty tough. If a residential job meets the 1999 NEC reuirements (this applies until 12/31/2007) then you have to approve the job. If it doesn't meet the 1999 NEC requirements then you have to know if it meets the NYS Residential code. The Residential code makes reference to the NEC, however, the Residential Code takes precedence. It doesn't make the inspectors job easy when the work was done sloppy or you have a beligerant Licensee trying to get you to just sign of the job and "ignore" a few little items. Sloppy work and poor behavior (both not requirements of any code) are reasons for me to take a lot closer look at the work. Yes, it is not part of being an inspector, but we are people, also. We are intrusted by the municipalities to attest that the jobs are to a minimum quality. I enjoy inspecting work. Many years ago when I first started hiring people I became an inspector of sorts. Now it is more of an official position. I am happy to be shown wrong. If I am questioned concerning a code issue I am happy to comply and show the person in writing. GCs and ECs with attitude problems (anyone else for that matter), just get me more pissed albeit I don't show it. I just "look a little bit closer" that's normally all it takes to find something not in line.
The jobs I do as an electrician, I make sure that they are 100% before going for an inspection. I want the inspector to be happy and I enjoy showing off quality work I am proud of. As an insepctor I guess I expect that of other ECs. I have run into sloppy work that is with-in code. I talk with the guys, try to impress upon them a bit, but if it meets code it has to pass. The extra time I put into these inspections is my personal committment to the industry. I don't make more money from spending an extra ten minutes with an electrician but I enjoy my time and normally the electrician also is happy.
My two bits inspecting Sullivan County to Rockland County, NY,

Roger123

Kapakahi,

Sounds like you are a solid good inspector. Thanks for the input. Wish every inspector would emulate you.


except for this.

kapakahi

And sometimes, I guess I talk too much!

Roger123

Nope, you're cool!

sparkyjmgjmg@comcast

most inspectors in this area are real cool guys they will not bust your b**** unless you ask for it. i used to work for a guy that even if the job passed he would still find some way to piss the inspector off. i always kill with kindness and i have never had an issue with anyone in the 10 years in this field. i see most Of the inspectors more than once so when they come its HEY HOWS IT GOING HOWS BUISNESS ETC....... its more of a social thing 5 minuets looking at the job 15 minuets talking makes a stressful job go a little easy sometimes

leland

210.8 (B) (2). GFCI in commercial/institutional kitchens.

NO exceptions. From the 2005 NEC.

What cycle are you on? thats the real answer.

edit: I see Alabama is on the 2005 NEC, no Ammendments I could see.

billsnuff

jamesvcambell, on page 77 of 05 handbook (other than dweling units) the only exception that i see is a location with a sink and a portable cooking appliance (corded microwave). otherwise it covers chuches, hotels, schools, dining halls w/kitchens, whether or not they (the outlets) serve countertops.

this was new in 02 and i don't have an '08.........we will begin with 05 in 08.

220/221

You don't talk too much but you sure can write one LONG paragraph.


If you break it up a little it's easier to digest.

skidrowpete

section 210.8(b)(2) states ALL 15 and 20 amp receptacles in non dwelling kitcens begfci protected no exceptionns

ralph

You guys that have electrical inspectors dont know how good you have it. Here ( savannah area ) we have building inspectors, they have very little knowledge of the NEC.
All they care about is nail plates. Its absurd.
Some of my competition are totally oblivious to the code.
I went into a house that I bid, and the outlets were spaced every 15 feet. No disconnect from the meter to the panel. ( about 45 ' away )
Af ci i the bedrooms, outlets only, lights were not on the af.
bonding of the rebar in the slab ----unheard of. ( I did it and got failed )
With all the hacking , these guys make good money .
I guess the point is ( beside me biching ) every area has different enforcment of the nec. Some more than others , obviously. this brings differnt interpratations, and along with that , different amendments.

tripbraker

i have a job coming up soon , ive yet to do work in this town - a small house in tioga tx and ive been told that i have to have 1 circuit per every 2 kitchen counter plugs being gfci protected of course , i thought they were joking cause ive always put at least 2 circuits per kitchen with no more than 6 openings on a circuit , ive even hit the frig first and then to my first counter plug being the gfci plug , dining room as well . well they say no joke and its nec code , ive looked in the code book but cant find it , it was like starring at a cows face for an hour . would you all help me find the code references because i think its silly having 4 circuits for kitchen counter plugs