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05-25-2012, 12:45 AM
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#61
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Registered Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: N.E.
Posts: 16,081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQ
They make that?
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I think they discontinued black THHN. Not enough demand.
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05-25-2012, 12:47 AM
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#62
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Registered Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: N.E.
Posts: 16,081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 480sparky
It costs money to put that plastic stuff around the copper. Since it's a GROUNDing electrode conductor, we use bare.
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Awesome. When I have a long enough scrap of #6 THHN, I use it for the GEC.
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05-25-2012, 12:47 AM
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#63
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Resi Service Electrician
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: California
Posts: 1,257
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by 480sparky
It costs money to put that plastic stuff around the copper. Since it's a GROUNDing electrode conductor, we use bare.
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For mine, since stupid ahj wants #4 regardless of size of service I carry a roll of #4 thhn and use it for 100amp servce conductors and gec. And since its #4 no need for that plastic stuff. 
__________________
"Understand one thing every one has a place in this trade, and no matter what your skill set I doubt you know it all." brian john
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05-25-2012, 12:52 AM
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#64
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Chief Electron Relocator
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cornpatch USA
Posts: 31,301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter D
Awesome. When I have a long enough scrap of #6 THHN, I use it for the GEC.
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Ah, we just buy it bare. Saves time & money. 
__________________
In winter, why do we try to keep the house as warm as it was in summer when we complained about the heat?
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05-25-2012, 12:54 AM
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#65
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Wire Ninja
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Beautiful Cumberland Valley, in PA
Posts: 16,794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electrictim510
For mine, since stupid ahj wants #4 regardless of size of service I carry a roll of #4 thhn and use it for 100amp servce conductors and gec. And since its #4 no need for that plastic stuff. |
I tend to run a lot of #4 also, but mostly to the GEC, since it often is exposed to physical damage. #6 won't cut it, in that regard.
__________________
One reason not to give DIY advice:
Catch a man a fish and you can sell it to him.
Teach a man to fish and you’ve ruined a good business opportunity.
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05-25-2012, 01:00 AM
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#66
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Registered Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: N.E.
Posts: 16,081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 480sparky
Ah, we just buy it bare. Saves time & money. |
You are such a tool.  I don't have to buy scrap wire to use as GEC's.
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05-25-2012, 01:01 AM
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#67
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Registered Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: N.E.
Posts: 16,081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MDShunk
I tend to run a lot of #4 also, but mostly to the GEC, since it often is exposed to physical damage. #6 won't cut it, in that regard.
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The inspectors in my area don't usually red tag #6 exposed.
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05-25-2012, 01:03 AM
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#68
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Chief Electron Relocator
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Cornpatch USA
Posts: 31,301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter D
You are such a tool. I don't have to buy scrap wire to use as GEC's. |
I use my scrap 6 for hooking up subpanels n such.
__________________
In winter, why do we try to keep the house as warm as it was in summer when we complained about the heat?
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05-25-2012, 01:06 AM
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#69
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Resi Service Electrician
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: California
Posts: 1,257
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Peter D
The inspectors in my area don't usually red tag #6 exposed.
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"Exposed" is usually opened to interpretation, and pretty loosely in some areas. In some areas in CA you ca run 6 on the wall as long as it is strapped well and is not in high traffic areas or something similar, but others do not want it anywhere but in pipe or in wall.
__________________
"Understand one thing every one has a place in this trade, and no matter what your skill set I doubt you know it all." brian john
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05-25-2012, 05:23 AM
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#70
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976-EVIL
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: State of Euphoria
Posts: 13,408
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(3) Other structures permitted to be of Types III, IV, and V
construction except as prohibited in 334.12. Cables
shall be concealed within walls, floors, or ceilings that
provide a thermal barrier of material that has at least a
15-minute finish rating as identified in listings of firerated assemblies.
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The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to mcclary's electrical For This Useful Post:
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05-25-2012, 06:13 AM
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#71
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ET Road Warrior
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Long Island, N.Y.
Posts: 27,323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcclary's electrical
(3) Other structures permitted to be of Types III, IV, and V
construction except as prohibited in 334.12. Cables
shall be concealed within walls, floors, or ceilings that
provide a thermal barrier of material that has at least a
15-minute finish rating as identified in listings of firerated assemblies.
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Here are the different construction classifications.. http://www.korel.com/construction-type.asp
TYPE V - Wood-frame construction is the most combustible of the five building types. The interior framing and exterior walls may be wood. A wood-frame building is the only one of the five types of construction that has combustible exterior walls. This is the typical single-family home construction method. These buildings are built with 2x4 or 2x6 studs and load bearing walls, wood floor trusses or wood floor joist and wood roof framing.
__________________
There comes a time when people who volunteer their service need to step back and see if it is better for them to retire. A red flag is when they become "cranky" and lose all sense of reality by making decisions that really don't make any sense..
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05-25-2012, 06:30 AM
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#72
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ET Road Warrior
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Long Island, N.Y.
Posts: 27,323
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334.10 was a recent code change to allow exposed NM as stated.. otherwise we would have the same problem with exposed cables in basements..
. Installation
334.10 Uses Permitted. Type NM, Type NMC, and Type
NMS cables shall be permitted to be used in the following:
(1) One- and two-family dwellings and their attached or
detached garages, and their storage buildings.
__________________
There comes a time when people who volunteer their service need to step back and see if it is better for them to retire. A red flag is when they become "cranky" and lose all sense of reality by making decisions that really don't make any sense..
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05-25-2012, 06:31 AM
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#73
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New England
Posts: 23,951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4T
334.10 was a recent code change to allow exposed NM as stated.. otherwise we would have the same problem with exposed cables in basements..
. Installation
334.10 Uses Permitted. Type NM, Type NMC, and Type
NMS cables shall be permitted to be used in the following:
(1) One- and two-family dwellings and their attached or
detached garages, and their storage buildings.
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It was never an issue in a basement as that was part of the dwelling unit. The issue was detached garages and sheds on dwelling unit property.
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05-25-2012, 06:35 AM
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#74
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ET Road Warrior
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Long Island, N.Y.
Posts: 27,323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQ
It was never an issue in a basement as that was part of the dwelling unit. The issue was detached garages and sheds on dwelling unit property.
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So a detached garage can have exposed NM using 2011 code but be red tagged if you're still on 2008 code.. 
__________________
There comes a time when people who volunteer their service need to step back and see if it is better for them to retire. A red flag is when they become "cranky" and lose all sense of reality by making decisions that really don't make any sense..
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05-25-2012, 06:59 AM
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#75
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Heavily Armed Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Fascistchusetts
Posts: 29,534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4T
So a detached garage can have exposed NM using 2011 code but be red tagged if you're still on 2008 code.. |
What is in the 2008 NEC that would make it different?
In this case the inspector is just busting his chops IMO.
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05-25-2012, 07:07 AM
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#76
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ET Road Warrior
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Long Island, N.Y.
Posts: 27,323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HARRY304E
What is in the 2008 NEC that would make it different?
In this case the inspector is just busting his chops IMO. |
the code change that was added for 2011..
__________________
There comes a time when people who volunteer their service need to step back and see if it is better for them to retire. A red flag is when they become "cranky" and lose all sense of reality by making decisions that really don't make any sense..
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05-25-2012, 08:23 AM
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#77
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976-EVIL
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: State of Euphoria
Posts: 13,408
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by B4T
So a detached garage can have exposed NM using 2011 code but be red tagged if you're still on 2008 code.. |
Yep, you're right.
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05-25-2012, 05:56 PM
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#78
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PGW Professional
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Rahway, NJ
Posts: 12,797
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 480sparky
#10 to the intersystem bond? |
(((( X ))))
#6 from the panel ground bus passing through to the ground rod. 
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05-25-2012, 06:01 PM
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#79
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PGW Professional
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Rahway, NJ
Posts: 12,797
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05-25-2012, 06:37 PM
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#80
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1,000,000th Poster
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Portland
Posts: 9,485
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I have nothing to contribute other than the inspector who failed that is a dink.
Also:
Quote:
Duct Seal Compound
Seals conduit openings against drafts, dust, moisture and noise.
• Protects terminal boxes, pot heads and bushings from corrosive elements.
• Deadens switch gear panel noise.
• Dough-like compound is easily “thumbed” over holes and gaps.
• Will not harden or form a skin under normal conditions.
• Not for use outdoors.
• Specifications:
- Viscosity: ASTM D-217 300-gram load - 7.0 -11.0; ASTM DS-S2
100-gram load - 9.0 -15.0
- Temperature Range: Adheres at -20 °F (-29 °C). Will not slump after
1 hr. at 350 °F (175 °C).
- Flash Point: Over 550 °F (285 °C).
- Other Properties: Non-conducting, non-deteriorating, non-toxic,
non-corrosive, non-staining, non-curable; 99% solid, coil-based.
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I would love to see someone use duct seal to deaden noise from switchgear; I imagine something like The 3 Stooges, only with more fire.
-John
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