Attic Safety - Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum
CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY, IT'S FREE!
Go Back   Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum > Tools, Equipment & Safety > Workplace Safety


Like Tree19Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-03-2019, 11:18 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default Attic Safety

A while back I had a 4" recessed can that would not turn on. It was connected to a Lutron Maestro dimmer switch. Being that it was a 4" halo can I could not access the connections from below as you can on a 6" can so I crawled into the attic to make my repair. I was kind of in a hurry and not thinking of safety as it was hot and I was upset that I had to go in the attic. The soffit I crawled into was metal stud and I got shocked when I cut out the wago connector to replace it with a wire nut. Dummy me I forgot to pull the Fass switch out on the dimmer and companion dimmer. Be careful and don't assume you are safe from being shocked just because the lights look like they are off.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Easy For This Useful Post:
Signal1 (10-03-2019)
Join Contractor Talk

Join the #1 Electrician Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

ElectricianTalk.com - Are you a Professional Electrical Contractor? If so we invite you to join our community and see what it has to offer. Our site is specifically designed for you and it's the leading place for electricians to meet online. No homeowners asking DIY questions. Just fellow tradesmen who enjoy talking about their business, their trade, and anything else that comes up. No matter what your specialty is you'll find that ElectricianTalk.com is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally free!

Join ElectricianTalk.com - Click Here JOIN FOR FREE


Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. ElectricianTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 10-03-2019, 12:16 PM   #2
zac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: CA
Posts: 3,000
Rewards Points: 822
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy View Post
A while back I had a 4" recessed can that would not turn on. It was connected to a Lutron Maestro dimmer switch. Being that it was a 4" halo can I could not access the connections from below as you can on a 6" can so I crawled into the attic to make my repair. I was kind of in a hurry and not thinking of safety as it was hot and I was upset that I had to go in the attic. The soffit I crawled into was metal stud and I got shocked when I cut out the wago connector to replace it with a wire nut. Dummy me I forgot to pull the Fass switch out on the dimmer and companion dimmer. Be careful and don't assume you are safe from being shocked just because the lights look like they are off.
Yeah, any dimmer I see the meter comes out. I got lit up wiring up a chandelier once.
I was holding the chandelier with one hand and twisting the wires with the other.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
Kevin_Essiambre likes this.
zac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 01:05 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

Good thing you didn't drop the chandelier. Don't get me wrong I love the performance and style of the Maestro switch but it can be a problem child in this Scenario. If you were to install one in a bell box with a weatherproof cover and you pull out the FASS switch and then let the cover close it will also push the switch back in. Probably always best practice to open the CB on any circuit you work on. Unfortunately it's not always an option when circuits are not identified. I'm sure someone will chime up and say .. Always kill power before you work on any system. I agree but we all take short cuts at times.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 10-03-2019, 01:14 PM   #4
Mensa Player
 
HackWork's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: -
Posts: 33,818
Rewards Points: 809
Default

I got shocked once on a ceiling fan that I turned off with the remote control because it was hardwired to constant power so there was no switch. I guess the remote circuitry lets some current bleed thru.

This is why I treat everything like it is hot. I avoid touching the hot conductor, I only touch it when not touching anything else, and I put the levernut on it first. That's yet another nice thing about levernuts, you cap off the hot with one first thing, then the hot is always safe and you never have to touch it again. Just put the additional conductors into the levernut when ready.
Bird dog and Kevin_Essiambre like this.
__________________
I'm trying to think, but nothing happens.
HackWork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 01:40 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

Hack .. I can see how levernuts can be a big advantage in that scenario. Attics are just a bad place to be in for any circumstance. I think at the time I got across the neutral and just that low current was enough to shock me. Sweet was probably factors as well. Another good way to get shocked is when you run into a broken raceway and one end is energized because there was no EGC only the raceway and the tail end is hot and the lead end is grounded.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Easy For This Useful Post:
Bird dog (10-03-2019)
Old 10-03-2019, 01:45 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

People do dumb things. Especially lazy journeymen. The worst shock I ever felt was on a 277 vt lighting circuit. I pushed open a tile on a t-bar ceiling and was touching the t-bar and some dumb ass left a bare wire hanging out.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 02:50 PM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 40
Rewards Points: 16
Default

Attics can be dangerous by themselves, when they get hot. I went in one once early in the morning when it was cool. The temperature slowly rose over the next couple of hours, slowly enough that I didn't 'feel' how hot it had gotten.

Once I stopped sweating, it dawned on me that I was in trouble and bailed. I figure another 10 minutes and I wouldn't have made it out.

Another one I was climbing through was like a mine field. Multiple live, open splices hidden in the blown in insulation. Got zapped multiple times trying to make my way back to the hatch.

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk
Kevin_Essiambre likes this.
Mobius87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 03:03 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Service Call's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Daytona Beach
Posts: 1,880
Rewards Points: 28
Default

One attic I was in had the points of nails sticking up into the space. There was no where to kneel without getting stuck. I charged triple time for that job.
Kevin_Essiambre likes this.
Service Call is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 05:25 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
460 Delta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Southern Ohio
Posts: 811
Rewards Points: 968
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HackWork View Post
I got shocked once on a ceiling fan that I turned off with the remote control because it was hardwired to constant power so there was no switch. I guess the remote circuitry lets some current bleed thru.

This is why I treat everything like it is hot. I avoid touching the hot conductor, I only touch it when not touching anything else, and I put the levernut on it first. That's yet another nice thing about levernuts, you cap off the hot with one first thing, then the hot is always safe and you never have to touch it again. Just put the additional conductors into the levernut when ready.
Quick question, do you have to strip the wire before you put it in the Wago or does it bite to the wire on it’s own?
__________________
Perfection is the enemy of good enough
460 Delta is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 05:31 PM   #10
Mensa Player
 
HackWork's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: -
Posts: 33,818
Rewards Points: 809
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 460 Delta View Post
Quick question, do you have to strip the wire before you put it in the Wago or does it bite to the wire on it’s own?
You definitely have to strip it. I doubt it would bite thru modern insulation, and it's definitely not rated to do that. Personally, I don't like insulation piercing connectors.
Bird dog and Easy like this.
__________________
I'm trying to think, but nothing happens.
HackWork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 06:22 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
460 Delta's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Southern Ohio
Posts: 811
Rewards Points: 968
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HackWork View Post
You definitely have to strip it. I doubt it would bite thru modern insulation, and it's definitely not rated to do that. Personally, I don't like insulation piercing connectors.
Yeah wire biters are a little sketchy, but if you're doing hot work in an attic, well they would have a place.
Kevin_Essiambre likes this.
__________________
Perfection is the enemy of good enough
460 Delta is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 06:32 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 40
Rewards Points: 16
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 460 Delta View Post
Yeah wire biters are a little sketchy, but if you're doing hot work in an attic, well they would have a place.
I disagree. That's the last place you would want to put a sketchy connection.

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk
Kevin_Essiambre, Easy and CoolWill like this.
Mobius87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 07:23 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
CoolWill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: SC
Posts: 2,246
Rewards Points: 2,778
Default

I thought this was going to be about attic heat. But electrically, if you don't turn the circuit off, you get what you get.
Bird dog and Kevin_Essiambre like this.
__________________
I'm With Her! Hillary 2016
CoolWill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 08:37 PM   #14
Band Member
 
emtnut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Eastern Ontario
Posts: 5,857
Rewards Points: 1,292
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Easy View Post
Good thing you didn't drop the chandelier. Don't get me wrong I love the performance and style of the Maestro switch but it can be a problem child in this Scenario. If you were to install one in a bell box with a weatherproof cover and you pull out the FASS switch and then let the cover close it will also push the switch back in. Probably always best practice to open the CB on any circuit you work on. Unfortunately it's not always an option when circuits are not identified. I'm sure someone will chime up and say .. Always kill power before you work on any system. I agree but we all take short cuts at times.
I don't usually kill the power with lighting either. Just recently I was adding a slim LED live. When I was connecting the live, the side of my hand touched the metal driver can. Not a big shock, but I felt it ... and worst of all, someone saw it Makes you look like you don't have a clue.

I didn't know about that Fass switch ? Is that new ???
I don't think I've seen it on the lutrons or levitons that I've used.
Easy likes this.
__________________
_____________________________________
Your Mother was a hamster, and your father smells of Elderberries. ... Now go away, or I shall taunt you a second time
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
emtnut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 08:48 PM   #15
Beam Me Up Scotty
 
Kevin_Essiambre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 841
Rewards Points: 164
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by emtnut View Post
I don't usually kill the power with lighting either. Just recently I was adding a slim LED live. When I was connecting the live, the side of my hand touched the metal driver can. Not a big shock, but I felt it ... and worst of all, someone saw it Makes you look like you don't have a clue.

I didn't know about that Fass switch ? Is that new ???
I don't think I've seen it on the lutrons or levitons that I've used.
I don't know when they introduced the FASS (front accessible service switch).

I do know that all lutron Caseta dimmers and switches have them.

Sent from my Samsung using Tapatalk
__________________
"If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy!"
Kevin_Essiambre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 08:55 PM   #16
Member
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Southern Alberta
Posts: 40
Rewards Points: 16
Default

It is easy to miss, unless you read the instructions thoroughly. If you're like me, the instructions never leave the box.

But it's not new, at least not in the past 5+ years.

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk
Mobius87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 11:34 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HackWork View Post
You definitely have to strip it. I doubt it would bite thru modern insulation, and it's definitely not rated to do that. Personally, I don't like insulation piercing connectors.
Maybe it might bight thru some wire on grandmas trailer. lol. Get the 4 conductor stripper so you can work 4 lines at once.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 11:36 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

Honestly I imagine the wagos have there place.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 11:46 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 460 Delta View Post
Quick question, do you have to strip the wire before you put it in the Wago or does it bite to the wire on it’s own?
I just don't think they are as reliable as a wire nut but I do see the time savings element. The ones that Hack showed are the better ones than the push ins. Both types have to be stripped. It's the wave of the future man.
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2019, 11:52 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
Easy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Southern California
Posts: 218
Rewards Points: 434
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HackWork View Post
I got shocked once on a ceiling fan that I turned off with the remote control because it was hardwired to constant power so there was no switch. I guess the remote circuitry lets some current bleed thru.

This is why I treat everything like it is hot. I avoid touching the hot conductor, I only touch it when not touching anything else, and I put the levernut on it first. That's yet another nice thing about levernuts, you cap off the hot with one first thing, then the hot is always safe and you never have to touch it again. Just put the additional conductors into the levernut when ready.
lever nuts are same as wire nuts .. yes / no ?
Easy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Our Pro Sites Network
ContractorTalk.com | DrywallTalk.com | HVACSite.com | PaintTalk.com | PlumbingZone.com | RoofingTalk.com