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Old 10-05-2012, 02:32 PM   #1
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Default 6 throws of the hand

I have a 1200 amp panel with 6 200 amp breakers and no main. I took one of the breakers out and added a 400 amp panel with a main next to it. Inspector said he might not pass it because someone could come along a put that 200 amp breaker back in. Sounds ridiculous to me
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Old 10-05-2012, 02:35 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by big vic
I have a 1200 amp panel with 6 200 amp breakers and no main. I took one of the breakers out and added a 400 amp panel with a main next to it. Inspector said he might not pass it because someone could come along a put that 200 amp breaker back in. Sounds ridiculous to me
Somebody would need to file for an inspection then and would get failed on it.
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Old 10-05-2012, 02:41 PM   #3
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Somebody would need to file for an inspection then and would get failed on it.
Exactly. The code isn't designed to include future intent. The AHJs aren't pre-crime, they are supposed to look at the installation, decide if it passes or not, and let the chips fall as they may.
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Old 10-05-2012, 02:48 PM   #4
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Inspector has no right to fail it based on "what if". It would be the next guys problem not yours. Good luck
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Old 10-05-2012, 03:10 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Alwon
Inspector has no right to fail it based on "what if". It would be the next guys problem not yours. Good luck
Correct inspector can not fail what happens in the future,inspector sound ridiculous to me.Its like installing a dedicated 120 volt circuit for a microwave and the inspector failing it because some1 could tap into it in the future LOL.
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Old 10-05-2012, 03:40 PM   #6
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The above posts are all true, but what if you wind up being the guy that has to go in later when they want another breaker installed in the empty space?
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Old 10-05-2012, 03:52 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erics37
The above posts are all true, but what if you wind up being the guy that has to go in later when they want another breaker installed in the empty space?
Then quote them to add a disco infront of the mb
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Old 10-05-2012, 04:22 PM   #8
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The above posts are all true, but what if you wind up being the guy that has to go in later when they want another breaker installed in the empty space?
inform them that the NEC does not allow it.
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Old 10-05-2012, 04:38 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erics37
The above posts are all true, but what if you wind up being the guy that has to go in later when they want another breaker installed in the empty space?
Take an existing 200 and sub in another panel.
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Old 10-05-2012, 05:10 PM   #10
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I don't see the problem with someone coming back in and changing that new 400A back to 200A (other than it being a dumb ass thing to do). What does that have to do with the 6-hand rule? Still 6 main breakers.

The 200A breaker would likely niusance trip if it has a 400A fully loaded panel down stream, but that still has zero relationship to the 6-hand rule.
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Old 10-05-2012, 05:15 PM   #11
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I don't see the problem with someone coming back in and changing that new 400A back to 200A (other than it being a dumb ass thing to do). What does that have to do with the 6-hand rule? Still 6 main breakers.

The spot where the 200 was is now empty, the inspector is worried someone might put it back for a total of seven breakers.

That said, the inspector is out of line but should be much more concerned with the size of the service conductors and the total calculated load.
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Old 10-05-2012, 05:18 PM   #12
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I was once required to take the bus clip hardware out of a service section for the same reason. Someone else may reinstall a switch. I was going to point out that someone could easily put the hardware back in but I figured it was a good enough compromise and only took a few minutes.

The engineer missed it, the estimator missed it and I missed it on the installation but the inspector caught it.
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Old 10-05-2012, 07:50 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denny3992 View Post
Then quote them to add a disco infront of the mb
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bbsound View Post
inform them that the NEC does not allow it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by backstay View Post
Take an existing 200 and sub in another panel.
It was a rhetorical question you guys
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Old 10-05-2012, 07:59 PM   #14
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Quote:
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It was a rhetorical question you guys

Just how is it that you are replying in a thread titled "6 Throws of the Hand" without a single reference to your.....er.........other hobby??
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Old 10-05-2012, 08:07 PM   #15
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Quote:
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Just how is it that you are replying in a thread titled "6 Throws of the Hand" without a single reference to your.....er.........other hobby??
Because I do that so often it takes way more than 6 throws.
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Old 10-05-2012, 09:51 PM   #16
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As long as the load calcs are below 1200 and its still 6 throw there is absolutly nothing that is of concern.
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Old 10-05-2012, 10:10 PM   #17
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Can you not put the 200a breaker back in and take the feed
for the other distro thru it !

I know its overdoing it but then he can't complain about someone
using the vacant spaces.
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Old 10-05-2012, 10:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Going_Commando View Post
Exactly. The code isn't designed to include future intent.....
I disagree here. What about section 404.2(C) ??

The informational note clearly states that requirement is for (future) use ...

This is but one instance where the Code can and does try to predict future installation and requires modification today for may be tomorrow ...
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