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Old 03-17-2019, 11:13 AM   #21
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Ends up taking that long cause there’s somebody who wants to argue every change.
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Old 03-17-2019, 11:25 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by nrp3 View Post
Ends up taking that long cause there’s somebody who wants to argue every change.
I start every update class with a disclaimer saying

“I did not make these new rules, nor can I change them, reguardless of how long we discuss them, so don’t shoot the messenger”
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Old 03-17-2019, 11:26 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Journey 2 Master View Post
What state are you in, and what requirements does your state have for continuing education every year?

In TX we have to do a 4 hour online (or classroom) course that basically just prompts you with code changes from the last code cycle, mixed with a little bit of licensing regs and violation punishments. Each screen is timed so you have to wait for the minute to count down and click to the next. Seems like a missed opportunity for real deep-diving education.

I'd love to have advanced courses on new lighting control technology, motor controls, videos, articles, etc...something that actually advances my education...and makes me know my craft better, rather than just screens that you have to wait to click to the next one and not really give a damn about.

Anyone else feel this way?
I worked for a medium size EC in Dallas for 20yrs. I'm retired now, but the company would host an instructor/inspector to come to our shop and give CEU class to the Masters and J-men who wanted to attend. There would be 20-30 attend, the company would have pizza and soda and pay for the class.
It would get your 4 hour knocked out in one sitting and you would leave with your renewal certificate.
They were never boring because you can discuss details with the instructor and workmates, estimators, PM's, etc. We would cover code changes and issues that are always confusing or interesting like MWBC's, grounding, derating, ambient temp calcs, etc
It was way better than those online courses which I hated
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Old 03-17-2019, 12:09 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Journey 2 Master View Post
Why do you believe that CE should be code only? There are many states that are still operating on 2008 and 2014 code cycles. Also I think that most people using a current code book can find the code updates in that book without taking a class over it. Just my opinion. I do see the benefit in having code changes in the CE package, but I also think there should be far more education included. Electrical safety, new methodologies in troubleshooting, motor controls, advantages/disadvantages in newest lighting control systems, how different transformers work, listing requirements, etc...there's so much that we're required to know that I think CE time is the place to handle it all.

It's not continuing my education if its just rinse and release code changes. I can sift through those for free by any of the major talking heads in the trade in about 20 min. I don't see that advancing me in my craft, though it is also essential info to know.

Also agree with you on the manufacturer influence. This goes deep and hard in our trade, even with the passage of code. (some will disagree with that). I just think there's so much more to know, and CE being required, seems like a great time/place to really cram in more knowledge. **** I'd pay double for more advanced knowledge on things I don't normally have access to.
Lighting controls, motors, transformers, etc., are all optional. Code is required therefore only code CEs should be required, all others should be optional but readily available.
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Old 03-17-2019, 12:15 PM   #25
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I don't like the idea of forced professional development because it reeks of gov't creep. I do it myself because of my own interest. I do like hearing about the latest products. I was late to our trade groups meeting the other night and the sales guys had aluminum conduit on hand and I would have been interested in that even if I never bought any. As a business owner, I need to know what's going on with product and code changes. We have forced continuing ed and testing as pilots.
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Old 03-17-2019, 12:17 PM   #26
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Our code classes here are awful. They are boring and basically it's the same class over and over with a handful of the new code rules thrown in.

It's a 15 hour requirement per code cycle here which is ridiculous. It does not take that long to go over new code rules.
That's why I don't like the hour requirement.

It needs to be pertinent changes only, not a minimum number of hours.
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Old 03-17-2019, 12:23 PM   #27
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We start at one end of the book and go to the end and without fail, it takes two whole days.
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Old 03-17-2019, 02:57 PM   #28
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Minnesota Master is 16 hours every other year, same as renewal for the license. It’s too bad it can’t be made to match the code cycle.
I used to do classroom for my CE credits and like was mentioned, someone tends to take up a lot of time questioning every code change or has a story about every situation the instructor brings up.
Once I changed to an on-line provider, I feel I get way more out of the education. I can do the hours on my time when I feel like learning and not thinking about something else. I can start and stop as needed and not miss something while I use the restroom, etc. I can skim over the codes that do not pertain to me and spend more time on those that do and I also find myself looking back months later at something that I suddenly need. Taking notes in a code book for me doesn’t do it. 31 years as a master for a school district and nearing retirement, I have never and will never wire residential.

Unfortunately Mike Holt is not an approved course for on-line in Minnesota but the provider I have found meets my needs.

Last edited by Dpcarls1598; 03-17-2019 at 03:01 PM.
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Old 03-17-2019, 06:32 PM   #29
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The last day long class I attended had a sort of guest speaker from Allen Bradley. He was sort of a class clown type but I found it entertaining and informative. Also got some valuable literature on VFDs.
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Old 03-17-2019, 09:44 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Journey 2 Master View Post
What state are you in, and what requirements does your state have for continuing education every year?

In TX we have to do a 4 hour online (or classroom) course that basically just prompts you with code changes from the last code cycle, mixed with a little bit of licensing regs and violation punishments. Each screen is timed so you have to wait for the minute to count down and click to the next. Seems like a missed opportunity for real deep-diving education.

I'd love to have advanced courses on new lighting control technology, motor controls, videos, articles, etc...something that actually advances my education...and makes me know my craft better, rather than just screens that you have to wait to click to the next one and not really give a damn about.

Anyone else feel this way?
I may become your new favorite ET guy here

I think there should be some extra training in these courses ... there are guys out there that have no friggin' idea what apparent power is, and they are posting really bad information on you-tube for apprentices.
Maybe if they had the proper training, they would be able to give proper information.

Just as an ex ....
listen to this ... not sure if this is for real, or a spoof You tube channel, but I know that Jobanna thinks it's great.

(same video, 2 bookmarked time spots)




Jeeeeezes christ on a cracker .... I can't stop laughing

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Old 03-18-2019, 09:32 AM   #31
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Default NFPA 70E Electrical Safety Classes

Delaware and Maryland require 5 CEU hours per year, for a total of 10 hours for every 2-year renewal cycle.
I deliver a 5-hour NFPA 70E How to Interact Safely with Electrical Systems that's approved by Maryland. I recommend this type of class for electricians because we are responsible to be in compliance with 70E, not just NFPA 70, the NEC.
I think the 70E class is much more interesting than any Code Changes classes, and it provides you with the ability to assess the dangers associated with the equipment you're interacting with.
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Old 03-18-2019, 11:19 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by emtnut View Post
I may become your new favorite ET guy here [IMG class=inlineimg]https://www.electriciantalk.com/images/smilies/biggrin.png[/IMG]

I think there should be some extra training in these courses ... there are guys out there that have no friggin' idea what apparent power is, and they are posting really bad information on you-tube for apprentices.
Maybe if they had the proper training, they would be able to give proper information.

Just as an ex ....
listen to this ... not sure if this is for real, or a spoof You tube channel, but I know that Jobanna thinks it's great.

(same video, 2 bookmarked time spots) [IMG class=inlineimg]https://www.electriciantalk.com/images/smilies/vs_laugh.gif[/IMG]




Jeeeeezes christ on a cracker .... I can't stop laughing [IMG class=inlineimg]https://www.electriciantalk.com/images/smilies/vs_laugh.gif[/IMG]

[IMG class=inlineimg]https://www.electriciantalk.com/images/smilies/devil.png[/IMG]
Isnt that the OP's second channel? 👀 If it's the J2M I'm thinking of then that's his channel lol
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Old 03-18-2019, 06:19 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by cdslotz View Post
I worked for a medium size EC in Dallas for 20yrs. I'm retired now, but the company would host an instructor/inspector to come to our shop and give CEU class to the Masters and J-men who wanted to attend. There would be 20-30 attend, the company would have pizza and soda and pay for the class.
It would get your 4 hour knocked out in one sitting and you would leave with your renewal certificate.
They were never boring because you can discuss details with the instructor and workmates, estimators, PM's, etc. We would cover code changes and issues that are always confusing or interesting like MWBC's, grounding, derating, ambient temp calcs, etc
It was way better than those online courses which I hated
This actually sounds badass. Was it more code-driven, or was it a mix of things?
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Old 03-18-2019, 06:21 PM   #34
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Lighting controls, motors, transformers, etc., are all optional. Code is required therefore only code CEs should be required, all others should be optional but readily available.
I agree with this, but I do think they should still be counted. My thought is a split of 50% code and 50% other topics (choices of topics) would be a great basis.
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Old 03-18-2019, 06:23 PM   #35
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The last day long class I attended had a sort of guest speaker from Allen Bradley. He was sort of a class clown type but I found it entertaining and informative. Also got some valuable literature on VFDs.
I'd love to sit and listen to an Allen Bradley rep talk. I'd ask WAY too many questions though lol
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Old 03-18-2019, 08:22 PM   #36
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Mike Holt
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Old 03-19-2019, 06:02 AM   #37
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That's why I don't like the hour requirement.

It needs to be pertinent changes only, not a minimum number of hours.
That would be nice.
I've found that some of these certified classes basically roll out the same power point program they had previous year and then "touch on" some of the new changes. I 'd rather they just cover the new changes and leave it at that.
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