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Old 09-10-2013, 06:08 PM   #1
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Default Hack work on top of hack work

My helper went to a call today that consisted of 3 breakers tripping and the awning lights not working.
He was able to get the breakers to reset. But the awning lights still did not work.
I was called in to resolve.

Wires shorted out in a conduit run I could not locate.
So I backfeed from a constant hot I found under the awning.
Told customer I could not guarantee the work.

It's a church with alot of handyman wiring.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:13 PM   #2
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That sounds dangerous. Why not find the short or abandon that run completely and run a new feed?
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:14 PM   #3
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That sounds dangerous. Why not find the short or abandon that run completely and run a new feed?
...because it was quicker to collect the $50 and give less than a break light warranty/guarantee.

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Old 09-10-2013, 06:19 PM   #4
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Wow.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:20 PM   #5
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That sounds dangerous. Why not find the short or abandon that run completely and run a new feed?
I spend an hour and a half on this. The conduit and any jb is buried. I pulled the lead wires from the source fixture and both the hot and neutral were broke from the short.
This circuit is hidden from the point I can access to the next jb.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:23 PM   #6
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I spend an hour and a half on this. The conduit and any jb is buried. I pulled the lead wires from the source fixture and both the hot and neutral were broke from the short.
This circuit is hidden from the point I can access to the next jb.
You still have to find the fault or abandon it. You can't leave it. Why would you want to when you could make more money by fixing it, nevermind it being safer?
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:24 PM   #7
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If the customer was happy with the quick patch up job ?
Then they are just as responsible too !

Some times you just gotta give the customer what he wants !
Even thou you think it is not "best practice".

I don't like to do it, but it's reality.
It's just the way some people operate.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:25 PM   #8
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If the customer was happy with the quick patch up job ?
Then they are just as responsible too !

Some times you just gotta give the customer what he wants !
Even thou you think it is not "best practice".

I don't like to do it, but it's reality.
It's just the way some people operate.
I don't know if it's that simple. As a licensed electrician, you are supposed to give a safe and code compliant installation. If the customer doesn't want to pay for that, then disconnect it completely.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:29 PM   #9
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I informed the customer that they may have a circuit trip in the future due to the live wires in the conduit we were unable to locate.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:31 PM   #10
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Quote:
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I informed the customer that they may have a circuit trip in the future due to the live wires in the conduit we were unable to locate.

....and the handyman wiring at the church continues.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:32 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmxtothemax View Post
If the customer was happy with the quick patch up job ?
Then they are just as responsible too !

Some times you just gotta give the customer what he wants !
Even thou you think it is not "best practice".

I don't like to do it, but it's reality.
It's just the way some people operate.

Wow



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Originally Posted by aftershockews View Post
I informed the customer that they may have a circuit trip in the future due to the live wires in the conduit we were unable to locate.

Live? You didn't disconnect them?

Wow again.
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:41 PM   #12
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At the very least after backfeeding a circuit, I would try to find the end of the run going back to shorted part of the circuit and isolate it from that section.

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I informed the customer that they may have a circuit trip in the future due to the live wires in the conduit we were unable to locate.
You guys need to invest in a locator. Trust me, you will get your moneys worth out of it!
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Old 09-10-2013, 06:59 PM   #13
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I don't understand:
- Circuit faults and trips, but breaker resets and holds.
- Load on circuit no longer works.
- Power is picked up ahead of damaged section of circuit to repower load.
- Damaged section of circuit is never disconnected, even though no longer used?

Is that right? I don't understand what made it necessary to leave the faulted section energized.
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Old 09-10-2013, 07:42 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Big John View Post
I don't understand:
- Circuit faults and trips, but breaker resets and holds.
- Load on circuit no longer works.
- Power is picked up ahead of damaged section of circuit to repower load.
- Damaged section of circuit is never disconnected, even though no longer used?

Is that right? I don't understand what made it necessary to leave the faulted section energized.
Laziness.
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Old 09-10-2013, 07:52 PM   #15
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From experience: last "responsible" electrician on the site "WILL" be held responsible if, God forbid, anything ever happens. Also, loooong court cases suck, especially when you are a defendant.
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Old 09-10-2013, 09:40 PM   #16
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From experience: last "responsible" electrician on the site "WILL" be held responsible
Well then "aftershockews" has nothing to worry about.
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Old 09-11-2013, 12:18 AM   #17
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Here we would disconnect it to make it safe charge our $90 rate to show up and give and estimate to repair it properly.
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Old 09-11-2013, 06:24 AM   #18
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Yep I can't leave unknown hooked up and walk, can't sleep at night if I do. I'd rather disconnect and let the client know they may call back for something not working later from the unhooked nightmare and then I'd deal with it. Make it safe for now and move on. Client says hook it up, no sorry call down the raod electric. Would you want to loose your liscense, insurance, or worse company to some handy man hack? Not me I work too hard for this S.
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Old 09-11-2013, 06:36 AM   #19
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I can't fathom leaving a job like that....

That breaker fails to trip and the whole place goes up, who do you think they [everyone] is coming after?
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Old 09-11-2013, 06:45 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by aftershockews View Post
My helper went to a call today that consisted of 3 breakers tripping and the awning lights not working.
.
My state may be infested with liberal fruitcakes who wouldn't know what the real world is like if it smacked them upside the head but it's crap like this that makes me glad I live here.

As for the rest of the story, hack, butcher, unqualified are a few things that come to mind.
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