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Old 02-22-2015, 12:03 PM   #21
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.....Employers have all the power and employees have none. ...........
Right there is the flaw in your thinking.
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Old 02-22-2015, 12:24 PM   #22
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This is pretty typical of what is expected of the apprentice working for a signatory shop.

What tools do you expect apprentices to supply?-image-3354680542.jpg
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Old 02-22-2015, 12:29 PM   #23
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I work with a guy right now who, before us, came from a larger non union commercial EC. He told me that they expected you to have all hand tools, battery drill, benders through 1", various fish tapes and a knock out set.

On top of it they didn't pay well either!!!
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Old 02-22-2015, 12:49 PM   #24
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That's nice. I'm going to start charging my employees for the work vans. I'll just take $20 a week out of their paycheck.
It was done so the Apprentices and JWs could replace lost or broken tools without taking a huge finacial hit, if I go out to my van this morning and the window is smashed and my pouch and toolbox is gone then I can get tools immediately and keep working even if I am strapped for cash.
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Old 02-22-2015, 12:51 PM   #25
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I work with a guy right now who, before us, came from a larger non union commercial EC. He told me that they expected you to have all hand tools, battery drill, benders through 1", various fish tapes and a knock out set. On top of it they didn't pay well either!!!
That would definitely be the exception.
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Old 02-22-2015, 01:26 PM   #26
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Same goes for tools stolen on the job or in the gang box overnight..if they belong to the company i'll bet the boss will find the bad guys AND you get new tools at no cost.

And, if a new company told me not to worry about tools, they would provide the broom and shovel, I'd keep looking.
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Old 02-22-2015, 02:01 PM   #27
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Are you saying that if your tools are stolen out of your work van, the employer makes you pay for replacement?? Wow...

That's what insurance is for, but I'm sure they want to save a buck or two
Im happy with my current employer, if I wasnt I would leave.
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Old 02-22-2015, 02:42 PM   #28
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When I started at the TELCO, the company supplied every tool to do the job. They were quality, name brand tools. The company even discouraged an employee from bring their own tools. Getting extra tools however was difficult. If you had a defective tool, bring it to your boss for a replacement.

As the years passed, the company still provides all the tools although of questionable quality and brands that you find at the Dollar Store. That's when I started buying my own hand tools. I also bought my own 14.4v Hitachi driver because using a 18v hammer drill to drive screws was overkill.
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Old 02-22-2015, 03:15 PM   #29
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It was done so the Apprentices and JWs could replace lost or broken tools without taking a huge finacial hit, if I go out to my van this morning and the window is smashed and my pouch and toolbox is gone then I can get tools immediately and keep working even if I am strapped for cash.
If one of my trucks, job boxes, job sites etc etc, gets busted into and some scumbag steals a mans (and the companies)tools, we immediately report it to police so the insurance company has a police report, then I send the employee to the industrial suppliers to buy all new tools. I get reimbursed form insurance at a later date.

That's the acceptable way to do it and its WHY we pay for insurance.


Otherwise......all we want the guys to bring is their hand tools, just what's on the list.
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Old 02-22-2015, 05:00 PM   #30
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You're a signatory contractor? As far as I know, most locals require contractors to carry insurance for the men's tools. Usually it's only for what's on the tool list. I don't know if many nonunion contractors buy that extra insurance.

I don't know what insurance they are required to have. I am sure they have insurance on everything that is on the jobsite including wire and fixtures.

I was on one job that all the tools were stolen out of the gang boxes. The contractor bought each man every tool that was on the tool list. In most cases that did not cover all the personal tools that were stolen, in other cases the guys did not have their tools in the gang box and refused the new tools. Some guys are honest.

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Old 02-22-2015, 05:40 PM   #31
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Right there is the flaw in your thinking.
Please show me an example of where employees have any real market power?

Tech companies in silicon valley agreed to settle a case on wage fixing, but do your really believe those tech companies are the only ones that are wage fixing? No, but it is fairly hard to prove and what joe electrician has the resources to go after their employer or who even dares.
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Old 02-22-2015, 05:48 PM   #32
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Exactly. That is what I was explaining to kg7879 above.


Although I personally think that's a bit harsh of a policy, I respect the right of your employer to institute it as I respect your right as an employee to voluntarily work for them.
We agree to disagree.

Now, If employees have real market power then that means they should job hop and look for the best opportunity for them. However that is severely frowned upon by employers. Would you as a contractor hire a electrician who has job hopped over some guy who has been with a company for 15 years?
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:02 PM   #33
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Please show me an example of where employees have any real market power?
Any city with a large union presence. Otherwise, the contractors/employers can and sometimes will take advantage of their influence/power.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:07 PM   #34
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Please show me an example of where employees have any real market power?

Tech companies in silicon valley agreed to settle a case on wage fixing, but do your really believe those tech companies are the only ones that are wage fixing? No, but it is fairly hard to prove and what joe electrician has the resources to go after their employer or who even dares.
Myself, for one.

Yeah, I know you'll immediately discount that. But I took care of myself back in those days. I stood up for myself. I never had a problem talking to my employer.

Too bad you think a handful of tech companies gone rougue means everyone 'fixes wages' and all employees willingly accept a carrot on a stick.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:12 PM   #35
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This is pretty typical of what is expected of the apprentice working for a signatory shop.

Attachment 48921
No wire strippers until their second year? 6 foot folding ruler? Hacksaw? Cresent wrench? And you wonder why unions are dying with stone age tools lists like that.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:15 PM   #36
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Well, I was always told to just bring hand tools, I am a professional and want my own set of tools as I progress in my career.

I bought my own m18 drill, impact set, my own 4ft and 6ft ladder etc.

I buy a lot of misc tools off my mechanic when he buys himself new ones, like cable compression connector crimp tool. Stuff like that.

I like the rule of thumb that if you have to borrow the tool more than once, go buy one.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:28 PM   #37
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Well, I was always told to just bring hand tools, I am a professional and want my own set of tools as I progress in my career.

I bought my own m18 drill, impact set, my own 4ft and 6ft ladder etc.

I buy a lot of misc tools off my mechanic when he buys himself new ones, like cable compression connector crimp tool. Stuff like that.

I like the rule of thumb that if you have to borrow the tool more than once, go buy one.
Just wait till you buy your own van and start using it for your company.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:29 PM   #38
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Just wait till you buy your own van and start using it for your company.

Hah! That's never gona happen. I don't even use my car to drive to the job.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:37 PM   #39
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No wire strippers until their second year? 6 foot folding ruler? Hacksaw? Cresent wrench? And you wonder why unions are dying with stone age tools lists like that.
Dying? Don't you mean being killed by politics funded by corporate America.
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Old 02-22-2015, 10:39 PM   #40
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Don't you mean being killed by politics funded by corporate America.
Who are you fooling? The unions are in bed with the political class that rules this nation.
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