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No relief is provided for. 210.12 states 'all 120-volt, single-phase, 15- and 20-amp branch circuits supplying outlets in dwelling units....."

FPN No. 2 refers you to 11.6.3 of NFPA-27 of the 2007 NFAC, but I don't have that book.

Besides, FPNs are not enforceable.
 

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I don't have the new codebook yet, so I need to know if it deleted the requirement for bedroom smokes to be on AFCI breakers. Anybody know?
There was never a requirement to protect "bedroom smokes". The requirement is/was for bedroom outlets. The smokes just coincidentally are mounted to outlet boxes.
 

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Smoke are within the NEC definition of an outlet. Therefore, AFCI protection is required.
I knew that, I was just making the point that smokes are not expressly mentioned.
It is not the intent of the code to protect smokes. The intent is to protect branch circuits serving "outlets".
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
Wow! The 2008 code just about shuts down re-wires or other casual work in existing homes! Is the way it is stated the way the AHJs are enforcing it?

I'm looking at an old home which still has some old BX and seriously deteriorated conductors -- definite hazard since some of the BX runs have been interrupted back to the panel.

So, if we re-wire from the switches to the lighting outlets to overcome the hazard and install smokes, we'll have to put all the branch circuits except the kitchen on AFCIs?

Pretty expensive.

While we're at it, I don't understand the little skirmish about the purpose of AFCIs relative to smokes. AFCIs are required on all bedroom outlets and smokes are utilization devices connected to bedroom outlets. It was possible that the code writers came to their senses and would make an exception for smokes, but if they did, they didn't make a clear one. In fact, the new code reads as if there are AFCIs that are like GFCI receptacles and can be located within branch circuits at the point of use. I haven't seen anything like that on the market.
 

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Several jurisdictions here have relaxed the AFCI/smoke requirement. At least one prohibits smokes from being AFCI protected.
 

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---In fact, the new code reads as if there are AFCIs that are like GFCI receptacles and can be located within branch circuits at the point of use. I haven't seen anything like that on the market.--


They have them, Ive never used it. Basicaly it's like a "dead" front GFI. The catch in 05It had to be fed by conduit, and the feed conductors not more than 6' from the breaker.

08' Ive seen the ART, (Don' quote me) But I think I read it can now be located at the 1st device, but still must be in conduit.
I don't have the hard copy yet, so I go online.So memory may be distorted.;)
 

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210.12

Same place- 210.12

exception 1; you can locate the 1st device with the AFCI module. Must be in pipe or AC with metal boxes.

exception 2: Afci can be ommited for smokes IF they are done in pipe or AC with metal boxes.

(summary, not a quote)
 

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What's the big deal with smokes on AFCI? Just jump a hot from the bedroom up there and be done with it.

Been doing it for years and never a problem of any smoke detector causing any afci to trip.

I mean, seriously, who in their right mind is going to pipe out smoke detectors just so they don't have to AFCI them?? Andy why would you pipe out to the receptacles just so you don't have to use a AFCI breaker??

Maybe I'm missing something but I don't get it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Well, Bilbequick, the issue isn't smokes on AFCIs, the issue is the new code requiring AFCIs for just about the whole house! In this house, that's close to a grand in AFCI breakers and the homeowner isn't going to do that.

I had planned to put the bedroom re-wires on AFCIs anyway -- can do with two -- at the most three -- and include the smokes, but I don't know how I can walk away from the new code since the AHJ is surely going to adopt it at the first of the year.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Yep, but that's a whole different problem. Using the code to push an agenda, then using insurance underwriters to enforce that agenda, all the while the homeowner has to invent deep pockets to meet questionable requirements.

How about this: A simple device which can detect arcs and sound an alarm? Good compromise. Won't happen. Not enough money in it.
 

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Don't get me wrong. I despise AFCIs and am TOTALLY convinced that they were pushed through by lobbyists with less of a concern for safety and MUCH more of a concern for making $$$.

GFIs are still being implemented into different applications some 30-35 years after their introduction.
Now we have AFCIs being introduced in the 1999 code to almost complete coverage only three cycles later.

I am glad I am in a state with some common sense as far as the code goes.
 
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