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Coffee drinking member
I pretwist and then use wire nuts. Solder pots rule.
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13,991 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Thank you Gov Newsom,
California has now banned the sale of small engines. This includes lawn mowers, leaf blowers, chain saws and,,,,, wait for it,,,,

portable generators.

I’m going to start selling them folks battery operated portable generators.
 

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Just trying to get home
Site Engineer
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2,666 Posts
Not accurate. The law, which is still being worked out, is asking for small engines to be zero emissions by 2028.
Read the actual bill:

“This bill would require the state board, by July 1, 2022, consistent with federal law, to adopt cost-effective and technologically feasible regulations to prohibit engine exhaust and evaporative emissions from new small off-road engines, as defined by the state board. The bill would require the state board to identify and, to the extent feasible, make available funding for commercial rebates or similar incentive funding as part of any updates to existing applicable funding program guidelines to local air pollution control districts and air quality management districts to implement to support the transition to zero-emission small off-road equipment operations.”

2028 isn’t even mentioned in the bill…where’d you get that from?

read it for yourself
 

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I like ceiling fans & EMT
Former commercial, occasional (small) residential
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955 Posts
Read the actual bill:

“This bill would require the state board, by July 1, 2022, consistent with federal law, to adopt cost-effective and technologically feasible regulations to prohibit engine exhaust and evaporative emissions from new small off-road engines, as defined by the state board. The bill would require the state board to identify and, to the extent feasible, make available funding for commercial rebates or similar incentive funding as part of any updates to existing applicable funding program guidelines to local air pollution control districts and air quality management districts to implement to support the transition to zero-emission small off-road equipment operations.”

2028 isn’t even mentioned in the bill…where’d you get that from?

read it for yourself
 

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Small off road engines are such a small piece to this puzzle. Why isn’t anyone targeting the biggest polluters, cruise ships and large airplanes? Tacle those and you will actually get a result. Everything else is just pointing a finger at the littlest kid in the room to blame for all the problems.
 

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I like ceiling fans & EMT
Former commercial, occasional (small) residential
Joined
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955 Posts
Small off road engines are such a small piece to this puzzle. Why isn’t anyone targeting the biggest polluters, cruise ships and large airplanes? Tacle those and you will actually get a result. Everything else is just pointing a finger at the littlest kid in the room to blame for all the problems.
Part of it is that there isnt much that can be done at a state level, and Congress isnt going to allow much at the federal level.

Cruise ships and airlines also have powerful lobbies.
 

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Coffee drinking member
I pretwist and then use wire nuts. Solder pots rule.
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13,991 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Not accurate. The law, which is still being worked out, is asking for small engines to be zero emissions by 2028.
“Expected availability of zero-emission generators”

I’m going to make a mint selling battery operated portable generators.
 

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Ready Mix concrete plant electrician
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2,590 Posts
Fun fact here in glorious lovely Ohio. There’s a city an hour north of me, that someone has built a few spots for EV charging. You pay your fee, plug in and get a quick charge for supposedly an hour drive time. Sounds good right? Well it’s all powered by a diesel genset sitting over on the parking lot side. I want my own now, but I want an non noise suppressed 4-71 Detroit Diesel at full 1800 rpm song. Giddy up.
 

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Chief Flunky
Field Service Engineer
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2,467 Posts
Small off road engines are such a small piece to this puzzle. Why isn’t anyone targeting the biggest polluters, cruise ships and large airplanes? Tacle those and you will actually get a result. Everything else is just pointing a finger at the littlest kid in the room to blame for all the problems.
Cruise ships run on diesel. The vast majority of the emissions from diesels is smoke particles. They already have particulate filters. No gain there.

Jet engines run on JP9, essentially a purified kerosene using a turbine which is also an extremely efficient engine. It uses far less fuel per passenger per mile than any current automobile except purely electric ones.

A far better way to save the environment is to replace that ridiculous open ditch across a desert supplying something like 50% of the water in the Colorado river to Southern California with something at least closed. We pump water from Lake Gaston in Virginia/North Carolina 55 miles to Virginia Beach using a pipeline. Our evaporative losses are basically 0.

Or how about putting limits on how big of an ice cream freezer you can legally put into a residential building? Might only have to set limits in San Francisco.

Or how about mandatory emissions and efficiency limits on server farms? And no, offsetting it by putting a giant wind farm in coastal North Carolina should not make it “zero emissions”.

Or how about…California needs to put emission limits on all energy sources regardless of where they are located. So they can’t for instance just shut down all power plants in the state and rely on output from surrounding states. Imported power should follow the as emission standards as in state!

Also there should be huge tariffs on imported labor to pay for all this. So farmers should pay a tariff for each “seasonal laborer” they use.

Also shouldn’t the state legislature be required to be gender neutral with quotas?
 

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Industrial / controls
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Eh, just the sale of new ones inside the state, Not like they are going to go rounding up old lawn mowers.

It's kind of dumb when you see all the waste at some of these plants but whatever,
 

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Small off road engines are such a small piece to this puzzle. Why isn’t anyone targeting the biggest polluters, cruise ships and large airplanes? Tacle those and you will actually get a result. Everything else is just pointing a finger at the littlest kid in the room to blame for all the problems.
The problem is, it is NOT a "small piece" of the puzzle. You have to realize that California is the MOST POPULOUS STATE with nearly 40 million people. If just Los Angeles county were a state, it would be the 10th largest population in the US (10+ million people), slightly larger than the entire state of Michigan. The pollution from gas powered landscaping equipment emitted each day in this state now exceeds the amount emitted by light duty passenger cars, because cars have been cleaned up in this state. Basically it (Small Off Road Equipment or SORE) is the next big target.

There has been an active campaign here for years to get people to voluntarily change to electric powered equipment and that has had a good effect on everyday homeowners. But the commercial market of landscapers is still almost entirely gas powered, much of that 2 stroke smoky little leaf blowers and trimmers in poor condition. On any given day in my neighborhood there are 4-5 guys running around getting paid for blowing leaves from one yard to another, the noise is sometimes too much for me working at home. I have a landscaper, I insisted that he use electric powered machines, he did and said he likes it better now. He keeps a bank of batteries in his truck and while using them at my house, he plugs in an extension cord and charges up the others. IT'S NO BIG DEAL!

As to generators, that issue is going to be dependent on whether or not manufacturers come up with acceptable zero-emission by 2024, probably resulting in affordable hydrogen generators like the Bloom Box that has been in development for years, but hasn't taken off because of lack of demand. If not, new fossil fuel powered generators will not be allowed to be sold or installed (legally) and that may result in a lot more people adding battery systems to their solar arrays. I'm doing that in about 2 weeks.

Electricians have been benefitting from this move for a long time now here in California. Diesel powered agg pumps have been under pressure to be retired for over a decade, meaning farmers have had to change to electric powered pumps, resulting in a LOT of electrical work throughout the Central Valley. Diesel powered rock crushers have been under the same pressures, the Air Resources Board has limited them to 1,000 hours per year, so most have been switching to electric powered. I for one do NOT complain about these things, it's good for our industry.
 
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