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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am a fire investigator in So. Cal. and need assistance from working electricians in the field. Have any of you seen a spike in calls to repair household wiring from a breakdown of the insulation?

I appreciate any input you may have.
 

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I am a fire investigator in So. Cal. and need assistance from working electricians in the field. Have any of you seen a spike in calls to repair household wiring from a breakdown of the insulation?

I appreciate any input you may have.
in a warm climate if there are a lot of power surges and failures.
you may see a spike in calls.
ambient air temp can have an adverse affect to insulation
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for the reply, the reason I ask is the large number of fires I am seeing where the insulation is breaking down from close proximity to the "Smart Meter" due to RF. Smart meters use the same 900MhZ as most appliances but the power modulation is far greater. This is causing breakdown in the PVC and eventually resistance arcing. I am seeing resulting fires but I also think that a simple dead circuit can be a result as well.

Thanks again!
 

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Thanks for the reply, the reason I ask is the large number of fires I am seeing where the insulation is breaking down from close proximity to the "Smart Meter" due to RF. Smart meters use the same 900MhZ as most appliances but the power modulation is far greater. This is causing breakdown in the PVC and eventually resistance arcing. I am seeing resulting fires but I also think that a simple dead circuit can be a result as well.

Thanks again!
Highly unlikely....Do you have any sources that suggest this is the cause?
Are the service cables breaking down or the internal building wiring?
 

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Thanks for the reply, the reason I ask is the large number of fires I am seeing where the insulation is breaking down from close proximity to the "Smart Meter" due to RF. Smart meters use the same 900MhZ as most appliances but the power modulation is far greater. This is causing breakdown in the PVC and eventually resistance arcing. I am seeing resulting fires but I also think that a simple dead circuit can be a result as well.

Thanks again!
Smart meters have slightly thinner tangs, so what you're most likely witness to is simply heat related incident(s) due to poor connections in older meter sockets

Further, many poco's farm out the meter swaps to non electricians paid piece meal, who just slam 'em on it as fast as they can, under a load, w/o PPE



~CS~
 

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Thanks for the reply, the reason I ask is the large number of fires I am seeing where the insulation is breaking down from close proximity to the "Smart Meter" due to RF. Smart meters use the same 900MhZ as most appliances but the power modulation is far greater. This is causing breakdown in the PVC and eventually resistance arcing. I am seeing resulting fires but I also think that a simple dead circuit can be a result as well.

Thanks again!

I am unsure how RF effects the wiring, but I do know that after a smart meter replacement the chances of a meter socket fire are much greater. The change out can further weaken an already marginal connection that might not have appeared or at a much latter date in time. Some of the smart meter replacements are done by contractors who often have little appreciation of what they are doing; the meter goes in crooked or is just shoved in where the meter jaws become bent or contact is poor. Anything like that will cause the meter socket jaws to arc and overheat.


Where are electricians exactly finding break downs? How old is the wiring?
 

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Thanks for the reply, the reason I ask is the large number of fires I am seeing where the insulation is breaking down from close proximity to the "Smart Meter" due to RF. Smart meters use the same 900MhZ as most appliances but the power modulation is far greater. This is causing breakdown in the PVC and eventually resistance arcing. I am seeing resulting fires but I also think that a simple dead circuit can be a result as well.

Thanks again!
So radio frequency is breaking down thermoplastic insulation? How many gigawatts are these transmitters? Is vinyl siding also breaking down? How about the bumpers of mom's minivan if she parks near the meter.

Something smells here.
 

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Chicken Steve offers 1 possible problem but the insulation is not breaking down due to radio frequency energies. To my knowledge you are the first to even ask?
If this was a phenomena it would effect your cell phone first as the device with the greatest exposure to RF.

In BC we have had several meter fires and all have been attributed to failed connections after the meter swap. In most cases it is partly due to thinner contacts on the smart meters and old meter bqases that have lost their spring tension on the meter tabs.

At the height of the meter swapping we got a repair permit or 2 every week. Surrey was getting several a day.

I asked why the meters were never replaced every XX years as Industry Canada says is required. The local utility said the error in old meters goes to the customer. Mechanical meters fail over very long periods of time but as they fail the meter runs slower and the accuracy diminishes, most often to the customer's benefit. Trouble when they get a new meter the electronic ones are accurate again and the customer learns what a bargain they have had but blames the Smart Meter instead of acknowleding they got something for nothing. When you explain they paid far less for years does not seem to trigger any urge to repay the utility for all those free electrons because the Mechanical meter slowed down.
heat will cause insulation to fail and a loose connection to the meter can cause heat greater than the temperature rating of the wire.
Now if you could actuall proves any connection fo SMart meters to insulation breakdown I think I could sell that to a few of our gulf islands here we keep our hippies.
 

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Another point, the strength of the RF has nothing at all to do with power modulation It is no different than the cell phone on your belt. It transmits a very low power radio signal unrelated to the power signature. It generally does not broadcast continuously either. Our system the meters send consumption data avery 10 to 15 minutes and the call duration is under 10 seconds including handshake and report. The last point is all the smart meters here transmit at lower power levels than you IPhone, galaxy, Blackberry, etc. You would see this probelm in your phone before you see it in a meter. I think a 10 year period of RF exposure from a smart meter equals about 1 30 minute phone call on a cell phone.

Secondly the actual electrical field has had wire in it's influence for over 100 years without anything like insulation breakdown causing insulation failures.

A hot connection can consume a lot of insulation before it sets anything external on fire.

Now if you can prove insulation breakdown by radio frequency I hope you publish your results as I think every TV and radio station, cell phone site and antennae should also be showing the same breakdown.

I seriously think you are barking up the wrong tree. That the problem is following smart meter swap outs is more likely failure of the jaws on an old meter base to tightly connect the new meter Tabs which are narrower.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Wow, I guess I had that coming by not capsulationg 3 years worth of research in the field. 42 years as a fire investigator hardly makes me a "tard" but duly noted. I am well aware of the installation issues and resulting fires from poor install. That is not what is needed here. As for RF, the NEC has code sections for shielding against RF for years. Therefore, at issue here is that in So. Cal. the smart meter modulates every 3 seconds. I know this varies from state to state. However, we have submitted evidence to a testing lab that has proven the molecular breakdown from the RF emitted from a smart meter already. My question here is not to open the dialogue of such a polarizing subject and be part of the conspiracy nuts, but to simply follow the physical evidence we have found and tested already.

Therefore, back to my original question, has anyone seen a spike in call outs to repair dead circuits and found any issues with the insulation? If you can help, thanks, if not please leave me out of the ridicule. I didnt come in here to call you guys out, I just need help in stopping the over 40 fires I have investigated in the past 2 years with this issue.
Thanks,
 

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Wow, I guess I had that coming by not (capsulationg) 3 years worth of research in the field. 42 years as a fire investigator hardly makes me a "tard" but duly noted. I am well aware of the installation issues and resulting fires from poor install. That is not what is needed here. As for RF, the NEC has code sections for shielding against RF for years. Therefore, at issue here is that in So. Cal. the smart meter modulates every 3 seconds. I know this varies from state to state. However, we have submitted evidence to a testing lab that has proven the molecular breakdown from the RF emitted from a smart meter already. My question here is not to open the dialogue of such a polarizing subject and be part of the conspiracy nuts, but to simply follow the physical evidence we have found and tested already.

Therefore, back to my original question, has anyone seen a spike in call outs to repair dead circuits and found any issues with the insulation? If you can help, thanks, if not please leave me out of the ridicule. I didnt come in here to call you guys out, I just need help in stopping the over 40 fires I have investigated in the past 2 years with this issue.
Thanks,
What do you mean by capsulationg ?

I am not trying to be picky , I just do not know what you mean !
 

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Wow, I guess I had that coming by not capsulationg 3 years worth of research in the field. 42 years as a fire investigator hardly makes me a "tard" but duly noted. I am well aware of the installation issues and resulting fires from poor install. That is not what is needed here. As for RF, the NEC has code sections for shielding against RF for years. Therefore, at issue here is that in So. Cal. the smart meter modulates every 3 seconds. I know this varies from state to state. However, we have submitted evidence to a testing lab that has proven the molecular breakdown from the RF emitted from a smart meter already. My question here is not to open the dialogue of such a polarizing subject and be part of the conspiracy nuts, but to simply follow the physical evidence we have found and tested already.

Therefore, back to my original question, has anyone seen a spike in call outs to repair dead circuits and found any issues with the insulation? If you can help, thanks, if not please leave me out of the ridicule. I didnt come in here to call you guys out, I just need help in stopping the over 40 fires I have investigated in the past 2 years with this issue.
Thanks,
Where are electricans finding these degenerated insulations? In the meter socket, panel, only near the meter, sporadically in the house?

The shielding is done but mainly for specialized equipment and tele communications circuits since that can cause interference mostly from outside RF effecting the system being shielded. The shielding isnt done because the RF actually breaks down the insulation, but rather for interference issues.

What properties did the wire exists that failed?
 

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Wow, I guess I had that coming by not capsulationg 3 years worth of research in the field. 42 years as a fire investigator hardly makes me a "tard" but duly noted. I am well aware of the installation issues and resulting fires from poor install. That is not what is needed here. As for RF, the NEC has code sections for shielding against RF for years. Therefore, at issue here is that in So. Cal. the smart meter modulates every 3 seconds. I know this varies from state to state. However, we have submitted evidence to a testing lab that has proven the molecular breakdown from the RF emitted from a smart meter already. My question here is not to open the dialogue of such a polarizing subject and be part of the conspiracy nuts, but to simply follow the physical evidence we have found and tested already.

Therefore, back to my original question, has anyone seen a spike in call outs to repair dead circuits and found any issues with the insulation? If you can help, thanks, if not please leave me out of the ridicule. I didnt come in here to call you guys out, I just need help in stopping the over 40 fires I have investigated in the past 2 years with this issue.
Thanks,
Ahh This sounds like there will be lawyers involved. Let me guess the insurance companies want to go after the power companies because of these fires.
 

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You may be a really good fire investigator, but that's still a world apart from being qualified and equipped to legitimately state that RF is breaking down electrical insulation. It seems extremely unlikely, and it's why I asked how you came to that conclusion.
Im questioning the same thing, how was the conclusion reached that any break downs are from smart meter RF. If the insulation breakdowns are occurring in the meter socket enclsure I could see why one would assume, but still the smart meter change is probably exposing a condition that was already there to start with. Breakdowns outside of that could be from anything. Its possible that an increased number of breakdowns are indeed occurring in a group of structures built around the same time containing a bad batch of wires or Chinese sheet rock that is being mistaken as smart meter caused.
 
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