Electrician Talk banner
1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone, new to the site but am finding it a very cool place to look and browse. Anywho, I have a couple of questions. Here goes.

How many twists do you put in your splice before you put your wire nut on? ( I usually make sure there is a good hold and see around 2-3 turns.)

How many wires do you limit on a wire nut? (I use the RED Ideas, and limit to 4-5 #12.)

How far down do you strip your wire before twisting? (I usually strip long, twist together, and on my kliens, there is a relief behind the cutting edge, I line up the insulation of the wire with this relief and cut. Perfect length every time.)

With grounds- Say you have a 4+ gang box and you have many many runs. How many ground will you put in that BLUE wire nut before you need another? Do any of you guys splice from one wire nut to another? or just drill in another ground screw and pig tail another lead off that?

Also, here is a little trick I picked up with those crappy b-caps. If you can get the red ones, 5 ft of 1/2 emt, and a drywall screw, you got a good pigeon shooter. Basically, get your Red buhcannon wirenut, Drill in that drywall screw about half to 3/4 way in so that the point faces out, put it in your 1/2 emt and you can now use it like a blow gun. If you got a framer with a compressor around, it makes things a whole lot funner. Be sure to destroy the evidence though, and dont leave them things layin' around.

Thx for leaving a respond. -Mike-
 

·
I own stock in FotoMat!
Joined
·
39,117 Posts
Hello everyone, new to the site but am finding it a very cool place to look and browse. Anywho, I have a couple of questions. Here goes.

How many twists do you put in your splice before you put your wire nut on? ( I usually make sure there is a good hold and see around 2-3 turns.)
Same for me.

How many wires do you limit on a wire nut? (I use the RED Ideas, and limit to 4-5 #12.)
Whatever the manufacturer states would be the limit. But most of the time it's just good old-fashioned 'feel'.

How far down do you strip your wire before twisting? (I usually strip long, twist together, and on my kliens, there is a relief behind the cutting edge, I line up the insulation of the wire with this relief and cut. Perfect length every time.)
No need to measure. I just strip enough to make the splice, then cut off any excess.

With grounds- Say you have a 4+ gang box and you have many many runs. How many ground will you put in that BLUE wire nut before you need another? Do any of you guys splice from one wire nut to another? or just drill in another ground screw and pig tail another lead off that?
Again, number of wires depends on the maker. They're not all the same.

Also, here is a little trick I picked up with those crappy b-caps. If you can get the red ones, 5 ft of 1/2 emt, and a drywall screw, you got a good pigeon shooter. Basically, get your Red buhcannon wirenut, Drill in that drywall screw about half to 3/4 way in so that the point faces out, put it in your 1/2 emt and you can now use it like a blow gun. If you got a framer with a compressor around, it makes things a whole lot funner. Be sure to destroy the evidence though, and dont leave them things layin' around.
All fun and games until someone loses an eye.:censored::no:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
160 Posts
The first place I ever worked they wouldnt even twist the wires before putting a wire nut on. They used those Ideal twist wire nuts and said its not required with those.
 

·
Golden Controls
Joined
·
616 Posts
The first place I ever worked they wouldnt even twist the wires before putting a wire nut on. They used those Ideal twist wire nuts and said its not required with those.
correct according to the listing you do not have to pretwist to have a solid connection, actually i believe most if not all ideal wire nuts do not require pretwisting:thumbsup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
337 Posts
I asked this question to the previous owner (still works in the shop after 50 years on the job).
He told me that if there would ever be a remote chance that you would want to disconnect a wire from the bundle in the near future, don't pre-twist. It is alot easier to take them apart when they have not been twisted with lineman's pliers.
But, if you definitely need a connection that will never come apart/loosen up, he told me to pre-twist before the wire nut.
Plus, any device that has motion, especially motor terminal boxes, he said to put some electrician's tape on the wire nut and surface of the wire. Kind of overkill, but if you stop and think how cheap tape is, I can't see how it could hurt.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
54 Posts
I twist the :censored: outta mine. I twist until I have at least 1" of tightly twisted insulation.

Not pre twisting the wires before wire nutting is absolutely rediculous. No matter what 'type' of wire nut you're using or how many wires you're splicing. That 'type' of wire nut may have made it into the bottom of the legal spectrum but don't let the quality of your work suffer because of it. A large portion of house fires are caused from loose or bad splices.
 

·
I own stock in FotoMat!
Joined
·
39,117 Posts
I twist the :censored: outta mine. I twist until I have at least 1" of tightly twisted insulation.

Not pre twisting the wires before wire nutting is absolutely rediculous. No matter what 'type' of wire nut you're using or how many wires you're splicing. That 'type' of wire nut may have made it into the bottom of the legal spectrum but don't let the quality of your work suffer because of it. A large portion of house fires are caused from loose or bad splices.
I'm in this camp as well. To me, the spring is to simply hold the nut on, not make the electrical connection. My 9kniens make the splice. The wire nut is just an insulator.

The only time I don't pretwist is when I'm splicing all stranded wires.
 

·
R.I.P. 2014
Joined
·
4,722 Posts
I use twisters and a driver in a battery screwdriver and I don't pretwist.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
885 Posts
;28539]I asked this question to the previous owner (still works in the shop after 50 years on the job).
He told me that if there would ever be a remote chance that you would want to disconnect a wire from the bundle in the near future, don't pre-twist. It is alot easier to take them apart when they have not been twisted with lineman's pliers.
hate to tell you but you rboss is wrong. Ideal (and I would presume the other major amnuf. state that pre-twisting is not neccessary but you must twist the wire nut until the wires are twisted together a certain amount, The result is the wires in the nut will get twosted together.



Plus, any device that has motion, especially motor terminal boxes, he said to put some electrician's tape on the wire nut and surface of the wire. Kind of overkill, but if you stop and think how cheap tape is, I can't see how it could hurt.[
$.50 a roll for 33+ is cheap?. I hate when people put tape on a wire joint. All it does is make a mess when you need to open it up.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,959 Posts
Assuming all 12g: If 4 wires on less I never pretwist, I just use the drill with the wire nut driver. 5 plus they get pre twisted. As a general rule, 5 wires in a red wire nut, more than 5 in blue. If there are a ton of ground wires I'll break up the wires between wire nuts, but to be honest I really don't like doing that, but it work and makes for a clean, neat job.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,966 Posts
I generally pre-twist, but Ideals don't require it and do a good job of twisting for themselves.

I never exceed the wirenut manufacturer's instructions on number of wires.

As for ECGs, I use Buchanans. I'm not sure I understand, but some inspectors have issues with wirenuts and ECGs, something to do with "permanent connections" I think.

In my experience, inspectors are okay with wirenuts from a device pigtail to an EGC lead in a box, but the ECGs entering and leaving a box have to be crimped.
 

·
Bilge Rat
motors and controls.........
Joined
·
8,435 Posts
I always pre-twist neutrals and grounds; you'll never take one of those apart hot. I never pre-twist phases or switch legs, but in reality, once the splice is complete they're pretty well twisted together anyway.

Generally speaking, in my experience, job guys will pre-twist everything, while service guys don't pre-twist anything. Exceptions abound, but it seems to lean that way.

Rob
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
I twist the :censored: outta mine. I twist until I have at least 1" of tightly twisted insulation.

Not pre twisting the wires before wire nutting is absolutely rediculous. No matter what 'type' of wire nut you're using or how many wires you're splicing. That 'type' of wire nut may have made it into the bottom of the legal spectrum but don't let the quality of your work suffer because of it. A large portion of house fires are caused from loose or bad splices.
I use Idea Twisters, and I don't pre-twist. I just crank down on the wire nut, and it's all twisted together.

I used to pretwist, saw someone not, and called him a butcher. He put on a wire nut, and took it off, and guess what? the wires were twisted together just like I would do with my Kliens.

Now if I'm doing 4 or 5 wires, I do pre twist, but not with 2 or 3.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
A different prospective on this subject.. In the 50's, they used to use the old style barrel connectors, crimped and wraped in electrical tape.
40 years later, a bad connection lead to a melting copper wire. This in turn lead to a half of house failure in lighting and power. I feel that is why they went to a spring in a wire nut. Expansion and contraction of a loose connection, still kept a tight connection because of the spring.
Also, I make a connection with a wire nut. Then, I try to pull each wire out of the wire nut (slight force). You would be amazed at how many times a wire will pull free.
Just my thoughts,
Kris.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
885 Posts
A different prospective on this subject.. In the 50's, they used to use the old style barrel connectors, crimped and wraped in electrical tape.
40 years later, a bad connection lead to a melting copper wire. This in turn lead to a half of house failure in lighting and power. I feel that is why they went to a spring in a wire nut. Expansion and contraction of a loose connection, still kept a tight connection because of the spring.
Also, I make a connection with a wire nut. Then, I try to pull each wire out of the wire nut (slight force). You would be amazed at how many times a wire will pull free.
Just my thoughts,
Kris.
barrel crimps are still legal and still used. They used to solder joints as well but that itsn't legal anymore (just solder). As the times change, new methods and materials are designed.

Twist on wire connectors also allow an easier alteration to the joint than any other type of connection except a polaris.($)
 

·
IBEW 332
Joined
·
246 Posts
I never pretwist and have never come across someone that does. I've only heard of it from travelers and on here. Weird how different practices are used around the country
 

·
Old Grumpy Bastard
GOV/MIL contracting
Joined
·
61,882 Posts
I pretwist them when mixing stranded with solid only.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
I never pretwist and have never come across someone that does. I've only heard of it from travelers and on here. Weird how different practices are used around the country
Wow! I'm surprised at how many people don't pretwist. I've never met an electrician that didn't. I agree with you about diffrent practices around the country. Funny thing is trade lingo. I was born and raised in CT learned the trade here then moved to FL for a while and the hardest thing was going to the supply house I had to learn material names all over again :laughing:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
I pretwist them when mixing stranded with solid only.
I do the opposite when splicing stranded to solid the wire nut will wrap the stranded around the solid. I find if you pretwist, the stranded will slide down the solid and not get caught under the spring sometimes.
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top