[duramaxdarren]

So now we have have arc-fault AND gfci protection on the same circuit....ridiculous. dih and dispoal circuit on and arc fault and have gcfi protection is over kill. pieces of equipment should not be on arc faults.

also is the fridge door swing is within 6ft of the sink or anything is within 6' ft its gotta be gfci protected, not just on countertops any more, and arc fault if i'm interpiting correctly:blink:

 

[sparky402]

So now we have have arc-fault AND gfci protection on the same circuit....ridiculous. dih and dispoal circuit on and arc fault and have gcfi protection is over kill. pieces of equipment should not be on arc faults. also is the fridge door swing is within 6ft of the sink or anything is within 6' ft its gotta be gfci protected, not just on countertops any more, and arc fault if i'm interpiting correctly:blink:

From what i understand is all except garage and bathrooms will be arc and in the kitchen it will be arc and gfi outlets/appliance. I think all washers are both also, not 100% sure. Bad thing is the gc will still expect our prices to be lower.

 

[Shockdoc]

So now we have have arc-fault AND gfci protection on the same circuit....ridiculous. dih and dispoal circuit on and arc fault and have gcfi protection is over kill. pieces of equipment should not be on arc faults.

also is the fridge door swing is within 6ft of the sink or anything is within 6' ft its gotta be gfci protected, not just on countertops any more, and arc fault if i'm interpiting correctly:blink:

we do most all our kitchen renovations without a permit. I don't support the afci movement, notice how they even contracted the wire manufacturers to date the cable only to aid in enforcement. Too many are blind to see that the nfpa is now a big business and personal interest run unit. I won't install AFCI s unless a permit is intact and an inspection is warranted. But realistically, the nfpa is destroying our trade.

 

[ponyboy]

we do most all our kitchen renovations without a permit. I don't support the afci movement, notice how they even contracted the wire manufacturers to date the cable only to aid in enforcement. Too many are blind to see that the nfpa is now a big business and personal interest run unit. I won't install AFCI s unless a permit is intact and an inspection is warranted. But realistically, the nfpa is destroying our trade.

Agreed. Walk down almost any street in America and I can personally guarantee you the majority of the homes are wired without any of the current systems in place were required to follow today. The fact that hundreds of millions of homes without arc fault and ground fault protection are still standing is simply miraculous. I bet most of them have 100 amp services with less than 20 branch circuits too

 

[ablyss]

So now we have have arc-fault AND gfci protection on the same circuit....ridiculous. dih and dispoal circuit on and arc fault and have gcfi protection is over kill. pieces of equipment should not be on arc faults.

also is the fridge door swing is within 6ft of the sink or anything is within 6' ft its gotta be gfci protected, not just on countertops any more, and arc fault if i'm interpiting correctly:blink:

Kitchen Area:
GFCI protection only required on kitchen counter spaces.
Appliances are not required to be GFCI protected unless they are easily moved around. The disposal is not required to be GFCI. Nor a trash compactor. If the fridge is plugged into a counter top outlet it needs to be GFCI otherwise not required.
Bathrooms get GFCI outlet regardless of size.
Other indoor wet locations other than bathrooms:
GFCI if within six ft of utility sink,
GFCI on juccuzi motor, or any motor that is in the same room as the water like sump pumps but not disposals.
All unfinished basements.
All garages including garage door openers and refrigerator outlets in garage
All crawl spaces
All outdoor locations and now code requires GFCI be outdoor rated.

Now AFCI go on all the following lighting and outlet circuits...
All bedrooms, hallways, sunrooms, corridors, foyers, but not laundry rooms unless the circuit leaves the laundry room (but definitely not the washing machine or dryer), all dining areas, breakfast room area, and finished basements.

There is no mixing the two together. That is don't put a GFCI outlet on a AFCI breaker. Hope that helps.

 

[Deep Cover]

Kitchen Area:
GFCI protection only required on kitchen counter spaces.
Appliances are not required to be GFCI protected unless they are easily moved around. The disposal is not required to be GFCI. Nor a trash compactor. If the fridge is plugged into a counter top outlet it needs to be GFCI otherwise not required.
Bathrooms get GFCI outlet regardless of size.
Other indoor wet locations other than bathrooms:
GFCI if within six ft of utility sink,
GFCI on juccuzi motor, or any motor that is within he same room as the water like sump pumps but not disposals.
All unfinished basements.
All garages including garage door openers and refrigerator outlets in garage
All craw spaces
All outdoor locations and now code requires GFCI be outdoor rated.

Now AFCI go on all the following lighting and outlet circuits...
All bedrooms, hallways, sunrooms, corridors, foyers, but not laundry rooms unless the circuit leaves the laundry room but definitely not the washing machine or dryer, dining area, breakfast room area, and finished basements.

There is no mixing the two together. That is don't put a GFCI outlet on a AFCI breaker. Hope that helps.

:no: 2014 changed all that.

 

[ablyss]

:no: 2014 changed all that.

Damn, you got me there !! :thumbsup: Gotta do my homework.

 

[ablyss]

Even though most AHJs still use the 2011... it is good to know where we are heading.

 

[Deep Cover]

Even though most AHJs still use the 2011... it is good to know where we are heading.

Not sure what you are getting at, but these new codes are exactly what this thread is about.

 

[HARRY304E]

we do most all our kitchen renovations without a permit. I don't support the afci movement, notice how they even contracted the wire manufacturers to date the cable only to aid in enforcement. Too many are blind to see that the nfpa is now a big business and personal interest run unit. I won't install AFCI s unless a permit is intact and an inspection is warranted. But realistically, the nfpa is destroying our trade.

And don't forget,not only is the wire dated,it also has GPS to signal the local inspector when it's being installed..:laughing:

 

[ablyss]

Not sure what you are getting at, but these new codes are exactly what this thread is about.

:laughing:

 

[LGLS]

All these new AFCI requirements are gonna put the kebosh on the use of 20/40 panels. Maybe that's a good thing.

 

[chicken steve]

Almost a decade ago the rumour was every circuit was going to end in either a gfci or afci

now it's coming true


~CS~

 

[HARRY304E]

Almost a decade ago the rumour was every circuit was going to end in either a gfci or afci

now it's coming true


~CS~

YUp and now that they have the AFCI/GFCI combo breakers that will be all that's available,

 

[electricmanscott]

So now we have have arc-fault AND gfci protection on the same circuit....ridiculous. dih and dispoal circuit on and arc fault and have gcfi protection is over kill. pieces of equipment should not be on arc faults.

also is the fridge door swing is within 6ft of the sink or anything is within 6' ft its gotta be gfci protected, not just on countertops any more, and arc fault if i'm interpiting correctly:blink:

Sounds like somebody just took a code class. :thumbsup: How have you been working for the last month and half without knowing this stuff?

Not sure where the "door swing" comes from. I don't have my book in front of me but I think it's any receptacle within 6 feet of the sink has to be GFI protected. That's in addition to countertop rules

Side note. I find it kind of funny how we always react negatively to pretty much all code changes. I agree that they are a pain in the ass and manufacturers are driving the code, BUT, these changes have already made me a couple thousand bucks that I wouldn't have made pre 1/1/14.

 

[electricmanscott]

YUp and now that they have the AFCI/GFCI combo breakers that will be all that's available,

Say what? :confused1:

 

[MTW]

And don't forget,not only is the wire dated,it also has GPS to signal the local inspector when it's being installed..:laughing:

:laughing::laughing:

 

[chicken steve]

BUT, these changes have already made me a couple thousand bucks that I wouldn't have made pre 1/1/14.

blood $$$

~CS~

 

[MTW]

Hopefully the new combo AFCI/GFCI breakers will be available soon and this will become a non-issue.

 

[chicken steve]

Methinks that needs a little clarification MTW.....~CS~