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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
From N. Yorkshire just joined napit full scope. was testing spur off a ring with mft 1502. plugged in volts plug leed got fault code middle and right spots not both other ones. on opening up found 240v between live conductors 18v phase cpc 20v neutral cpc.

went to source pulled out spur ir test of spur passed. but her is the no brainer at this socket where spur was taken volts plug in polarity confirmation was ok.

back at db did ring tests which revealed breaks in both neutral and in cpc. i founds something like 3 points with neutral faults and one with cpc fault.

put whole lot back together everything tested great including zs for every point including spurs.

my main point is that the martindale plug in tester (if i had one) would not have revealed a faultin the ring asfor some strange reason it was only at the spur theproblem was highlighted but the actual problem was of thering and caused by 3 different points badly connected (all in kitchen of course)

not as easy as it is on the 2391 test board is it?
 

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Hi Paul. Interesting post. And from your description of it ' baffling' Anyhow. Majority of members on this site are USA based. They love to hear from us but they need to be able to understand us too. Equipment code such as Martindale and MF1502 plus course examination numbers as'2391' don't help them much. Cpc is as we both know is a circuit protective conductor ( unsheathed copper grounding lead within a cable) and Zs refers to a value of Impedance measured from a certain location. But they may not. These folks are highly qualified, modest and humorous but we need to help them out as they so often do for me.

Great to have you on the forum. And I don't think we can be living too far apart.

Frank
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the pointers Frank, At the time I posted I hadn't realised it wasn't a UK forum.

I'm in Scarborough.

I suppose they don't suffer the vagueries of the ring main. Most of the world uses radials don't they?

I heard a story of a Spanish electrician dying because an English electrician had put in a ring main in Spain.

I'm not really sure why they got so established in the UK.
 

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Welcome Paul! :thumbsup:

Although a lot of us are from the US, we have some guys (Like Frank) from your side of the pond, and a couple from "Down Under" as well! C'Mon in!:thumbsup:
 

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Thanks John,

It'll be good for me to pick up tips from your side of the pond.

A builder I know came back from Florida holliday saying if an electrician or a plumber goes to that complex from Britain for a holliday they will sign him up do all the paperwork and he doesn't even n eed to go back to Britain. I am a gas fitter (not strictly a plumber but the lines are merged) aswell as an electrician (and I do 50% both trades at the moment).

What I find this year is that only regular customers ask me to do plumbing, there are vertually no new business, in England everyone has become a plumber.

My real love is fixing combi boilers, I am the service agent for a brand of boiler, and will take on all comers. I try always to repair rather than go for replacement. Don't charge until a few weeks afterwards, because older combis can take a while to reveal all their faults and people in the UK are now very mistrustful of tradesmen (especially plumbers) due to one sided consumer programs reporting on a very small minority.

In both trades we now have a situation where the costs to us have been escalated by the government, which was supposed to elkevate the standard of work in peoples homes, but so far has just widened the pricing difference between a professional and a diy or local handyman job. Hence the net result is more costs for the professionals and less work. But we will get through it.

Sometimes when I go to fix a newly installed combi it was the elctrician who was at fault. On a recent newbuild with solar hot water blended with a combi the manufacturers sent me. The registered electrician (as a new build needed a sign off) had managed wrong polarity at the boiler, wrong polarity at the system controls, and wrong control connections at the system controls, and his round wire flex to the combi was cut too short, so it didn't fit into the clamp and the front didn't drop down sufficient for me to service the boiler. I just fixed it all for free, because the manufacturer I do these repairs for sees the installer as their customer (people on the whole buy the combi the installer recommends) and will bend over backwards to please him.

I have yet to find out your system, but I believe it is a similar thing to our building site system, where we isloate, transform down to 110v and attach the appliance protective conductor at the centre tap of the secondary, so there is only 55v between either live conductor and ground.

In the UK domestic situation we have various earthing systems, but on the whole one of the live conducters (neutral) is roughly at ground potential and the other (phase) is at a nominal 230v (to conform with Europe, 240v in reality.) Electronic circuit boards can malfunction if the polarity is wrong, sometimes straight away, sometimes after a day's use. You wouldn't believe how common it is.
 
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