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Ready Mix concrete plant electrician
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This right here is about the one reason that I haven't completely quit the internet all together. Little nuggets of information that make all the difference and have been learned through experience being passed along. Especially helpful to poeple like me who dont neccesarily get to work directly with a lot of experienced poeple. On a side note I thought electricians weren't allowed hammers, I thought that's what linemans were for....
Everything is a hammer except for a screwdriver, that’s a chisel.
I have carried a small ball pein for years, it’s always in my service bag. It’s the tool to give a rounded out Phillips the old ball pein massage, hit it three or four times and close the slots up then bang in your beater Phillips, most of the time it will come right out.
 

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Purely a question out of general curiosity, I cant say I've seen many larger feeder taps let alone done one. Polaris lugs? Bolt on insulated distribution blocks? split bolts and 4 rolls of tape....? Some product I've never heard of because I'm not in the construction side of the field ?
Seen all of the above.
Installed "Polaris" lugs (T&B/ABB also makes multiport insulated lugs) and distribution blocks.
 

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Water treatment plant maintenance
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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Does anybody ever tape over the top of Polaris lugs ?
 

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Purely a question out of general curiosity, I cant say I've seen many larger feeder taps let alone done one. Polaris lugs? Bolt on insulated distribution blocks? split bolts and 4 rolls of tape....? Some product I've never heard of because I'm not in the construction side of the field ?
I've done more connections than I'd care to remember and ninety-five percent of the time have used Polaris or Ilsco taps they are by far the easiest and fastest.
 

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Tool Fetish
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I tried using Polaris connectors when they first came out years ago. Got a carton of free ones directly from Polaris to try; was pretty impressed. We installed hundreds of them. Actually purchased them directly from Polaris before they started selling through distributors. Had a few problems using them; melting down in some larger motors. Found ones by Penn Union that are made of copper. Been using them in motors and other splices for awhile with no problems to date. Can only be used with copper conductors. I have never used aluminum conductors anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
My only experience with Polaris lugs have been a few I have found in motors. Never personally had an issue, have heard stories of them going bad in motors so I tend to stick with eyes, bolts, and tape. Polaris lugs would seem to be way faster though.
 

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Polaris taps is where it's at for me. Fast, easy, never had a problem with reliability. Can't speak on behalf of what you found in motors, but motors do vibrate so that might be the underlining issue with using Polaris taps around things that vibrate. Not sure though because I've never run into that issue so far. Using them in gutters/boxes, Polaris taps is where it's at 100%. To answer your question, I always tape mine up, just a good habit to get into. Might not ever make a difference but something that takes 2 seconds and gives me ease of mind is why I do it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Motors that I have redone with them I taped them up just like I would a regular eye and bolt connection. For gutters and boxes it seems like they would be really convenient.
 

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My experience is ANY type of connection with large stranded wire should be wiggled, pulled on, tapped or whatever is appropriate to get the strands to nest and lie tight under pressure and get out any bridged stands that can let go after you think you've tightened them and cause a misfunction at the junction. I do it 3 times to be sure.
 

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Bilge Rat
motors and controls.........
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My experience is ANY type of connection with large stranded wire should be wiggled, pulled on, tapped or whatever is appropriate to get the strands to nest and lie tight under pressure and get out any bridged stands that can let go after you think you've tightened them and cause a misfunction at the junction. I do it 3 times to be sure.
Same here.....it seems to help but sometimes they still burn up.

The only ones I've never seen burn up is factory crimp motor leads bolted to crimped incoming lines.
 

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Same here.....it seems to help but sometimes they still burn up.

The only ones I've never seen burn up is factory crimp motor leads bolted to crimped incoming lines.
I think crimped connections like Burndy or T&B are the best too. However, you still have the problem with bolts. Flat washers or lock washers are not the greatest idea. I just got finished at a customer's retightening 18 of 24 connections from disconnect to breaker through inductors to DC drive secured with nothing but flat washers and a few lock washers for good luck. I use spring washers like Belleville and TORQUE them properly. Customer didn't want me to provide and change.
 

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Tool Fetish
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I think crimped connections like Burndy or T&B are the best too. However, you still have the problem with bolts. Flat washers or lock washers are not the greatest idea. I just got finished at a customer's retightening 18 of 24 connections from disconnect to breaker through inductors to DC drive secured with nothing but flat washers and a few lock washers for good luck. I use spring washers like Belleville and TORQUE them properly. Customer didn't want me to provide and change.
Majority of our projects contain multiple motors. First choice, we use stainless steel bolts, nuts, flat washers and bellville washers whenever we can make up crimp motor connections. Second choice, on larger motors that are almost impossible to fit crimp lugs on properly, we will use the Penn Union IMLC insulated copper connectors; like Polaris only copper and not as many sizes available. Last resort we use bugs; but not the kind everyone here is talking about. We use the Burndy mechanical bugs #KVS44 with the two bolts instead of the "split bolts" that are hard to tighten properly without using a hammer on them. The KVS bugs can be tightened with an impact gun and easily reused. Split bolts usually seem to get stripped or cross threaded. Also, any high strand content conductors (motor conductors, G & GGC cables, welding cables, locomotive cables) we will wrap the conductors with copper foil before inserting into any mechanical connector; not compression lugs. Copper foil is 0.005" by 2" wide.
156420
 

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Bilge Rat
motors and controls.........
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I think crimped connections like Burndy or T&B are the best too. However, you still have the problem with bolts. Flat washers or lock washers are not the greatest idea. I just got finished at a customer's retightening 18 of 24 connections from disconnect to breaker through inductors to DC drive secured with nothing but flat washers and a few lock washers for good luck. I use spring washers like Belleville and TORQUE them properly. Customer didn't want me to provide and change.
Bellevilles are great but they are too big to use on small motors.

I agree, proper torque is critical with these, most guys over torque and flatten them and it ruins the whole effect.
 

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Bilge Rat
motors and controls.........
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Majority of our projects contain multiple motors. First choice, we use stainless steel bolts, nuts, flat washers and bellville washers whenever we can make up crimp motor connections. Second choice, on larger motors that are almost impossible to fit crimp lugs on properly, we will use the Penn Union IMLC insulated copper connectors; like Polaris only copper and not as many sizes available. Last resort we use bugs; but not the kind everyone here is talking about. We use the Burndy mechanical bugs #KVS44 with the two bolts instead of the "split bolts" that are hard to tighten properly without using a hammer on them. The KVS bugs can be tightened with an impact gun and easily reused. Split bolts usually seem to get stripped or cross threaded. Also, any high strand content conductors (motor conductors, G & GGC cables, welding cables, locomotive cables) we will wrap the conductors with copper foil before inserting into any mechanical connector; not compression lugs. Copper foil is 0.005" by 2" wide. View attachment 156420
Do you use anti-seize on stainless? I always do, stainless will gall up once it's tightened and it's nearly impossible to loosen up if left bare.
 

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Do you use anti-seize on stainless? I always do, stainless will gall up once it's tightened and it's nearly impossible to loosen up if left bare.
The cleanest way to dispense the never-seeze is in the chapstick style tube. I keep one in my service bag to use on that kind of hardware.
 

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Tool Fetish
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Do you use anti-seize on stainless? I always do, stainless will gall up once it's tightened and it's nearly impossible to loosen up if left bare.
Always use a drop of oil on all stainless hardware. We use a lot of cable tray with all stainless hardware that is tightened with an impact wrench. The drop of oil lets us remove the hardware 10 to 15 years later with no problems for renovations. We do use a lot of anti-seize on everything else threaded that we install, on all hardware and even on all galvanized conduits and fittings. Learned that working on amusement piers over the ocean 30 years ago. Been using it since. I probably have 5 or 6 one pound cans of it on the shelf. Use a lot more than the small tubes would allow.
 

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Did anyone beside me ever these the T&B Pigtail Disconnects for motors? I think these are brilliant. Probably the only reason more people didn;t use them is they weren't aware and the cost over bolts and tape. If Labor is your primary cost though, then these are the ticket.
156436
 

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Bilge Rat
motors and controls.........
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Did anyone beside me ever these the T&B Pigtail Disconnects for motors? I think these are brilliant. Probably the only reason more people didn;t use them is they weren't aware and the cost over bolts and tape. If Labor is your primary cost though, then these are the ticket.
View attachment 156436
I've seen those but they look like a flimsy connection plus how would you terminate more than one motor lead to one incoming wire?
 
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