[XCasper]

With fluorescent ballasts the diag is always on the ballast and if you follow that you should be good right? That's how it has always been for me before today anyway. In a T12 4 lamp 2x4 we are replacing the lamps and ballasts with programmed start (Sylvania QTP 4x32T8/UNV PSX-SC) ballasts and T8 lamps.

The diag on these show a complicated but clear enough wiring. The problem is that it still doesn't work. I've called others who have given specific ideas including the other options I attached here.

I've now wasted half a day trying to figure this out so someone please tell me what I done so I'se can bang my head against the wall when I realize how simple it was.

 

[hangle]

are you installing new sockets or using the old ones?

 

[Quiksilver22]

Did you install them live?

 

[XCasper]

continued

are you installing new sockets or using the old ones?

We are reusing the existing sockets. However, we did replace the sockets in the second fixture just to see if it made a difference. It did not.

Did you install them live?

I guess that depends on your definition of live. We cut the feed to the existing ballast first then install the code required linear disconnect. At this point the new ballast and wiring configuration is completed then the disconnect is reconnected making the fixture live again.

As a point of interest we tried a few 2-lamp fixtures and they have all worked when wired up exactly as shown on the ballast diagram.

 

[Service Call]

A lot of the newer sockets I've seen come with only one side being able to terminate. It looks like the ballast is requiring "both" sides to terminate due to its using the filament to complete the circuit. Is this possibly how your sockets are configured?

 

[XCasper]

A lot of the newer sockets I've seen come with only one side being able to terminate. It looks like the ballast is requiring "both" sides to terminate due to its using the filament to complete the circuit. Is this possibly how your sockets are configured?

The newer sockets that only have one side avail have an internal jumper connecting both sides. One newer 2-lamp T8 fixture was like this and I replaced those sockets but because we are reusing the old sockets that were previously wired for T12 in the 2x4's we have had both sides avail. so far.

 

[BBQ]

A lot of the newer sockets I've seen come with only one side being able to terminate. It looks like the ballast is requiring "both" sides to terminate due to its using the filament to complete the circuit. Is this possibly how your sockets are configured?

This is correct with programed start.

And even if the sockets have terminals on both sides they can be shunted type which means all the terminals are connected together inside the sockets.

We installed about 5,500 programed start ballasts in a warehouse and any shunted sockets had to be replaced.

 

[XCasper]

curiouser and curiouser

As mentioned above after the epic fail with the 4-lamp ballasts we tried some 2 lamp fixtures and they worked fine following the diag on the ballast. Bolstered by this success we have now tried some 3 lamp fixtures and again they worked fine. So now maybe this isn't a wiring method problem after all since the difference between a 2, 3, and 4-lamp ballast is akin to adding another 4-way switch in line with 2 3-ways and another 4-way. We even went down to the end of the hall to another room and tried a different 4-lamp fixture to no avail. This room would have had a ballast from a different case of ballasts as well. I'm still flummoxed by this. I have others calling suppliers and manufacturers in the morning while we sleep.

 

[XCasper]

shucks

... any shunted sockets had to be replaced.

I was really hoping this was the solution. Alas neither the old sockets nor the new sockets I experimented with are shunted.

 

[Service Call]

Any luck?

 

[XCasper]

still waiting

At about 5 minutes before they closed today I was given the number to an engineer at Sylvania so that supposedly he could figure it out. Will call tomorrow.

 

[electricmalone]

At about 5 minutes before they closed today I was given the number to an engineer at Sylvania so that supposedly he could figure it out. Will call tomorrow.

Dumb question, but did you verify all 4 bulbs were good? I ran into issues a while back with 1 bad bulb in the group caused ballast to not ignite any lamps. Also had one entire room we had to leave power on for about an hour before lamps magically lit. Try 4 new bulbs, make sure they are the full wattage version not an energy saver lower wattage, makes a big difference on occasion for what seemed to be an initial burn in period for the ballast. Good luck chasing a ghost...

 

[XCasper]

Dumb question, but did you verify all 4 bulbs were good? I ran into issues a while back with 1 bad bulb in the group caused ballast to not ignite any lamps. ...make sure they are the full wattage version not an energy saver lower wattage...

All good points. I was specifically told that because Programed Start ballasts are wired in series that one bad lamp could cause all 4 to fail so yes we checked that. However, we are using 25w 841 lamps to replace the 32w T-8's. I hadn't heard before that those could be issues only that with prog start "the sockets are the key" to all your problems.

After I speak to this guy from the manufacturer tomorrow I'll see what he has to say then start again with his suggestions if any. If I keep having issues then I will be sure to attempt 32w lamps. Thanks

 

[Norcal]

Dumb question, but did you verify all 4 bulbs were good?

I had a case of new lamps which had 7 bum lamps, made by GE (Good Enough) so cannot even rely on new lamps.

 

[electricmalone]

I had a case of new lamps which had 7 bum lamps, made by GE (Good Enough) so cannot even rely on new lamps.

I worked for Sylvania, we would get random cases of bulbs that had 10-15 bad bulbs. They had an issue for a short period of time getting a rare earth element that took the place of mercury in their bulbs. To the OP, if you can get your hands on a neon tester, you can verify the bulbs working before you waste time putting them in a fixture. I had one for a while, but left it 80ft up in a Sunoco sign next to the highway, no getting that one back. After that I had an extra 2 lamp 2x4 drop in fixture at a storage facility the company rented for me where I would bench test bulbs at random before I went to a remote site.

 

[XCasper]

FYI , once I spoke to the guy from the manufacturer he asked me a few questions to ensure that I had tried certain things. When I indicated I'd done each of his suggestions he promptly indicated that I should contact whomever I purchased the ballast from and have them tested.

I did go back and try 28w lamps instead of 25w to no avail I thought but the next day we discovered the 28w lamps were burning. The designer is now shipping different ballast with a normal power factor that is supposed to work better with the 25w he wants to use. Guess we'll see.