[TGGT]

Hello,



First time posting here. Was just wondering what type of workloads most project managers were used to. Most of our jobs are 90-250k 2-4 person 8-16 week projects. How many projects should each PM be assigned? What are your thoughts about having a field supervisor(s) between PM and foreman? Any information would be greatly appreciated.



Thanks!

My opinion as a lowley foreman is that for larger companies with larger jobs, dividing supervision between projects just leads to delays and mistakes. I always hear talk about why hiring more people costs too much but I've seen too many jobs lose money because they were poorly managed.

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[MHElectric]

Im not sure you need a field supervisor in between the PM and foreman on projects that size. It's only like 4 guys on a job, right? You can just have the foreman call twice a week to check in and let everyone know what the progress of the job is.

The PM can walk the jobs each week, assuming he's only doing PM and not other stuff too, like estimating, etc. In that case it may be a little harder to do.

 

[telsa]

I've never seen that arrangement.

PMs are customer's men. They are not to run work. Their primary purpose is to close the EXTRAS.

They should be viewed as aides to the foreman and field super... the guys that actually get things done.

The crew does the work, the PM handles the customer and the payments.

Supers should NEVER be under the authority of a PM. They report to the license holder.

 

[MHElectric]

I've never seen that arrangement.

PMs are customer's men. They are not to run work. Their primary purpose is to close the EXTRAS.

They should be viewed as aides to the foreman and field super... the guys that actually get things done.

The crew does the work, the PM handles the customer and the payments.

Supers should NEVER be under the authority of a PM. They report to the license holder.

What?

 

[macmikeman]

What?

Do not question the Telsa........... He said it, and so it must be.

 

[telsa]

In business, management is normally split between production and sales.

The crew, the foreman, the field super are the production arm. A PM is not expected to wear sacks.

The Project Manager is expected to be the EXCLUSIVE contact man with the paying customer -- excepting the EC himself, the license holder. He is the emperor, he can do anything.

The foreman and the office process EXTRAS -- with the PM in the loop. But it's the PM's job to make those dreams come true. In most Big Contracts there is virtually no profit in the base contract. Yes, it's that insanely competitive. Every EC is praying for EXTRAS. The PM's primary job is to get the paying customer to cough up the dough. The base contract is already in hand -- and it's no money maker... usually.

This is true up and down the scale. Base contracts only look great when you've got no competition -- when it's a no-bid contract. At all other times, it's dog eat dog. Most builds are standard fare. Every EC of size can jump into the soup.

During the 2008 turn down, one piddling $20,000 Tenant Improvement project received 25 bids from GCs -- each of whom had solicited multiple bids from ECs. Does that give you an idea of how absurd it can get? In my burg, half the contractors just shut down... even substantial players.

When the PM screws the EXTRAS up -- he gets canned. PMs don't win contracts. The Office wins contracts. That's where the PM is directly under the control of the license holder, who is really calling the shots.

Is that clear?

 

[flyboy]

In business, management is normally split between production and sales.

The crew, the foreman, the field super are the production arm. A PM is not expected to wear sacks.

The Project Manager is expected to be the EXCLUSIVE contact man with the paying customer -- excepting the EC himself, the license holder. He is the emperor, he can do anything.

The foreman and the office process EXTRAS -- with the PM in the loop. But it's the PM's job to make those dreams come true. In most Big Contracts there is virtually no profit in the base contract. Yes, it's that insanely competitive. Every EC is praying for EXTRAS. The PM's primary job is to get the paying customer to cough up the dough. The base contract is already in hand -- and it's no money maker... usually.

This is true up and down the scale. Base contracts only look great when you've got no competition -- when it's a no-bid contract. At all other times, it's dog eat dog. Most builds are standard fare. Every EC of size can jump into the soup.

During the 2008 turn down, one piddling $20,000 Tenant Improvement project received 25 bids from GCs -- each of whom had solicited multiple bids from ECs. Does that give you an idea of how absurd it can get? In my burg, half the contractors just shut down... even substantial players.

When the PM screws the EXTRAS up -- he gets canned. PMs don't win contracts. The Office wins contracts. That's where the PM is directly under the control of the license holder, who is really calling the shots.

Is that clear?

No, not really. You're all over the place. Let the mushrooms wear off and try again.

 

[macmikeman]

In my experience PM's were in charge of the Gant scheduling mainly and were the way the company owner avoided having to receive telephone calls all day long from the property owners .... It's why the company general manager always hired PM's who came to the interview with shiny cowboy boots. So they could sit thru the meetings , and write the letters.

 

[wcord]

In business, management is normally split between production and sales.

The crew, the foreman, the field super are the production arm. A PM is not expected to wear sacks.

The Project Manager is expected to be the EXCLUSIVE contact man with the paying customer -- excepting the EC himself, the license holder. He is the emperor, he can do anything.

The foreman and the office process EXTRAS -- with the PM in the loop. But it's the PM's job to make those dreams come true. In most Big Contracts there is virtually no profit in the base contract. Yes, it's that insanely competitive. Every EC is praying for EXTRAS. The PM's primary job is to get the paying customer to cough up the dough. The base contract is already in hand -- and it's no money maker... usually.

This is true up and down the scale. Base contracts only look great when you've got no competition -- when it's a no-bid contract. At all other times, it's dog eat dog. Most builds are standard fare. Every EC of size can jump into the soup.

During the 2008 turn down, one piddling $20,000 Tenant Improvement project received 25 bids from GCs -- each of whom had solicited multiple bids from ECs. Does that give you an idea of how absurd it can get? In my burg, half the contractors just shut down... even substantial players.

When the PM screws the EXTRAS up -- he gets canned. PMs don't win contracts. The Office wins contracts. That's where the PM is directly under the control of the license holder, who is really calling the shots.

Is that clear?

Holy crap Batman!!
Actual complete sentences and paragraphs.

 

[Southeast Power]

I've never seen that arrangement.

PMs are customer's men. They are not to run work. Their primary purpose is to close the EXTRAS.

They should be viewed as aides to the foreman and field super... the guys that actually get things done.

The crew does the work, the PM handles the customer and the payments.

Supers should NEVER be under the authority of a PM. They report to the license holder.

I have to agree, except for the segue part.
For us the shop superintendent had a group of foremen or a couple of general foremen that answered to them. The PM, like the estimators, answer to the GM, VP, or owner.
Years ago, a PM was paid X amount for each million dollars of work they managed.
When I had that job, I was to walk the job, answer to the GC if we had any problems with scope creep, safety, of schedule problems.
We would order materials requested by the GF, schedule delivers, and write a predicted amount of change orders.