Electrician Talk banner
21 - 40 of 52 Posts

·
child please.....
Joined
·
5,311 Posts
Because the one style is designed to replace existing twins, not add a circuit to an already crowded panel.

Square D does the same thing. They make two types of tandems.
I'm not sure I understand you. So what is the tandem that fits on all buss styles for?
 

·
Always Learnin'
Joined
·
1,294 Posts
Listen to what I am saying. Murray makes 2 types of twins. The first is the regular twin that fits on a 30/40 buss. The second has a deeper slot that is made to fit on a buss that would not ordinarily take a twin breaker. I don;t think its a big deal to use them, why would they make a product that would violate some ul listing?
I know the twins you are talking about. They are called "Non CTL" and are not for use in a panel they aren't listed for. A straight 30/30 or 40/40 is not listed for the use of twin breakers. I have seen guys do this and make a 40/40 panel a 58 circuit panel and they got tagged.
 

·
child please.....
Joined
·
5,311 Posts
I know the twins you are talking about. They are called "Non CTL" and are not for use in a panel they aren't listed for. A straight 30/30 or 40/40 is not listed for the use of twin breakers. I have seen guys do this and make a 40/40 panel a 58 circuit panel and they got tagged.
OK, gotcha.I thought you doubting they exist. What panel are they used in?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,118 Posts
Listen to what I am saying. Murray makes 2 types of twins. The first is the regular twin that fits on a 30/40 buss. The second has a deeper slot that is made to fit on a buss that would not ordinarily take a twin breaker. I don;t think its a big deal to use them, why would they make a product that would violate some ul listing?
Those breakers are clearly marked on the side "FOR NON CTL USE ONLY."

No biggie in my book. They now allow 80 circuit panels, so not suprisingly I was ahead of the game!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
There are two types of breakers, a circuit limiting ie. the SD with the hook that has to go thru the plastic rail in a QO panel, no hole, no go. The other is non- circuit limiting like the QO tandem without the hook where the average hack can put 56 circuits in a 40 cicuit QO panel so he doesn't have to get a permit.Same as with a ITE QT 20/20 which is circuit limiting or the ITE QT 20/20 NC which is not.
 

·
Always Learnin'
Joined
·
1,294 Posts
If you have a panel with 80 spaces, you could still not put in tandems unless it's rated for them.
Exactly. I haven't seen a stab-in panel listed for more than 42 circuits yet. Maybe they are out there but I haven't seen them in my corner of the world yet.
 

·
I own stock in FotoMat!
Joined
·
39,117 Posts
Exactly. I haven't seen a stab-in panel listed for more than 42 circuits yet. Maybe they are out there but I haven't seen them in my corner of the world yet.
I have yet to see one, either.

Maybe they're making them out of those mysterious pieces of metal that alledgedly fall onto the prongs of a cord plug when it's partially inserted into a receptacle.
 

·
I own stock in FotoMat!
Joined
·
39,117 Posts
Why does he get special treatment? Cause he's union and I'm not? That's not fair!
No. But like I said.... my grandpappy told me once, "Son, if you can't say anything nice about someone, don't say anything at all."

That's why I don't say anything about JB.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,411 Posts
Siemans Panels

It has been mentioned a couple of times but I am still wondering...could the panel be re-distributed and open a couple of free slots?
 

·
Registered
Electrician
Joined
·
3,550 Posts
Discussion Starter · #35 ·
More info.
The house is 6 years old, not an old panel by any means.
House will soon be for sale, so current owner does not care about future expansion.
I got to thinking about making the sub a 120 volt panel, and call it a day.
A 40 amp single, with 8/2.
Load is a small shed, a pond pump and another circuit for convenience.
Thoughts on that idea?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
16,095 Posts
The non CTL tandems also cost 2-3 times as much. I believe the last time I looked the normal tandem SQD QO was $18 while the non CTL was $45.
Yeah, I had to use one not that long ago in a panel that was beyond maxed out. Because we all know an electrician would never use one of those against its listing. :whistling2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
352 Posts
Yeah, I had to use one not that long ago in a panel that was beyond maxed out. Because we all know an electrician would never use one of those against its listing. :whistling2:
It's cheaper to use your linemens pliers on the $18 model, don't ask how I know :whistling2:
 
21 - 40 of 52 Posts
Top