[ohiosparky99]

#10 ground and you need GFCI protection for the hot tub

 

[Paul S.]

#10 ground and you need GFCI protection for the hot tub

Thanks! That's what I'm understanding also... what about a service plug? I don't see that there is a requirement for that... just would like to be sure.

 

[chicken steve]

680.41 Emergency Switch for Spas and Hot Tubs.
A clearly labeled emergency shutoff or control switch for the
purpose of stopping the motor(s) that provide power to the
recirculation system and jet system shall be installed at a point
readily accessible to the users and not less than J ,5 m (5 ft)
away, adjacent to, and within sight of the spa or hot tub. This
requirement shall not apply to single-family dwellings.
680.42 Outdoor Installations. A spa or hot tub installed
outdoors shall comply with the provisions of Parts I and II
of this article, except as permitted in 680.42(A) and (B),
that would otherwise apply to pools installed outdoors.

(A) Flexible Connections. Listed packaged spa or hot tub
equipment assemblies or self-contained spas or hot tubs
utilizing a factory-installed or assembled control panel or
panelboard shall be permitted to use flexible connections as
covered in 680.42(A)(1) and (A)(2).

(1) Flexible Conduit. Liquidtight flexible metal conduit or
liquidtight flexible nonmetallic conduit shall be permitted.

(2) Cord-and-Plug Connections. Cord-and-plug connec-
tions with a cord not longer than 4.6 m (IS ft) shall be per-
mitted where protected by a ground-fault circuit interrupter.





~CS~

 

[Dennis Alwon]

#10 ground and you need GFCI protection for the hot tub

Wait a minute. #10 equipment grounding conductor but a #8 for the equipotential bonding.

You need a disconnect and depending on the code cycle etc you may need the equipotential bonding around the perimeter of the tub 18-24 inches from the inside wall of the tub and 4-6 inches below subgrade. This gets tied to the motor.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Make sure the tub doesn't need a neutral as some of them need 6/4 nm cable. #8 is only good for 40 amps and many tubs are 50 amp

 

[Paul S.]

I did browse through 680 on this. Part 1 and part 4 apply to my installation as far as I know. I also learned from Mike Holt's forum that I need, or should, check with the manufacturer's instructions. I think some manufacturers require an equal size equipment ground conductor.... To me, it looks like only parts of the tub need to be bonded, with a number 8 as a minimum. It does not say that it has to go all the way back to the panel. (It only says that the parts have to be bonded together... I looked up the definition of "bonded" and it doesn't say anything about being grounded or connected at the panel.) I am pretty sure this is a listed tub unit. As far as the 40 amp circuit rating goes , that was what the customer had stated. I do plan on looking at the owners manual and the nameplate rating if I can get it from him. I may just upsize the wire and give him a price so I don't waste too much time on this. But, it's not a complete waste because I am learning here. Thank you for all your replies..... It's been a long time since I have hooked up a hot tub.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I did browse through 680 on this. Part 1 and part 4 apply to my installation as far as I know.

This is true but once the hot tub is installed outside then part II applies-- 680.42

 

[Paul S.]

This is true but once the hot tub is installed outside then part II applies-- 680.42

Ok thanks! I'll definitely take another look at that. I just checked the manufacturer's instructions (the customer just sent them to me) and they do in fact require a number 8 grounding conductor. So much for using romex!

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Don't confuse the equipment grounding conductor with the equipotential bonding.

 

[Paul S.]

Ok, I'm curious as to why part 4 says that only part 1 & 4 apply to hot tubs and spas. 680.40... This is a bit confusing to me. If I remember correctly, the last time I hooked up a hot tub, we did not worry about bonding the different parts in the spa itself. (That is probably normally done by the manufacturer where necessary... ??) I only remember making my connections to their terminals in their electrical box.

 

[Paul S.]

Don't confuse the equipment grounding conductor with the equipotential bonding.

I hope I don't sound stupid here, but it would be more stupid to perform an incorrect installation so I am going to ask. Does the equipotential bonding conductor, (if one is required), have to go all the way back to the panel or can it be connected to the ground conductor for the circuit supplying the spa?

 

[Honestly]

Read this

http://www.mikeholt.com/download.ph...80_Pools_and_Similar_Installations_PART_2.pdf

 

[backstay]

I hope I don't sound stupid here, but it would be more stupid to perform an incorrect installation so I am going to ask. Does the equipotential bonding conductor, (if one is required), have to go all the way back to the panel or can it be connected to the ground conductor for the circuit supplying the spa?

All the way to the panel, I think you can also hit the GE or GEC.

 

[Paul S.]

This is true but once the hot tub is installed outside then part II applies-- 680.42

Not wanting to argue with you, (I am interested in code clarification only), but 680.42 states "A spa or hot tub installed outdoor shall comply with the provisions of Parts I and II of this article, except as permitted in 680.42(A) and (B), that would otherwise apply to pools installed outdoors...." Then in the provisions for 680.42(B) it lists the conditions.
I am looking to install what I believe to be a spa or hot tub that is listed as s self contained spa for aboveground use. (I believe the other provisions are also met.) - With that said, what I see, is that I do not really need to worry about part II. (Maybe I am wrong here.)
As far as the bonding (equipotential bonding) having to go back to the panel board or service, 680.26(B) says it does not have to.
Thanks for your valuable input! (That goes for everyone who posted here.)

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I never said the equipotential bonding needs to go back to the panel. In fact I said it goes back to the pump motor. Depending on the code cycle you are under you may not have to have the equipotential bonding at all. It sounds like you are under the 2014 so you don't need the equipotential bonding if you meet those criteria.

I believe I mentioned all this before.

 

[Pete m.]

.

I believe I mentioned all this before.

You did. I'm not sure the OP was reading what you wrote.

Pete

 

[Paul S.]

You did. I'm not sure the OP was reading what you wrote.

Pete

Yes, I probably overlooked what was said earlier, or didn't quite put everything together.... But, thanks everyone for the answers. It is definitely worth it, for me, posting here.

 

[macmikeman]

Now it's my turn to question. Since it is outdoors and now part II of 680 applies to this isn't the nmb out of the question now for any part of this not running on the interior of the building? (might be on the far side of the deck away from the exterior wall of the dwelling) OP mentioned he was going to run nmb for his hot tub.

 

[Paul S.]

Now it's my turn to question. Since it is outdoors and now part II of 680 applies to this isn't the nmb out of the question now for any part of this not running on the interior of the building? (might be on the far side of the deck away from the exterior wall of the dwelling) OP mentioned he was going to run nmb for his hot tub.

Yes, I believe I made the statement, "So much for using NMB." (Maybe I didn't.) In any case, because the manufacturer requires a number 8, or an equal size equipment grounding conductor, that eliminates the possibility of using NMB for any part of the run.