[macmikeman]

I got a call from a customer whom I rewired her 3 bedroom house for a while back. She had hired a PV company to come install panels on her roof, and as soon as the job finished she started having issues with the afci's in the panel tripping randomly and consistently. The afci's have not given trouble in the past. She calls the PV company about it , they send the "electrician" back to the house to troubleshoot the problem. Solution= removed the afci breakers and substituted in standard breakers. So she calls me and tells me what has transpired. I call the pv company and talk to the "electrician" who tells me it is just a test for a week or so to see if the system will trip standard breakers. WTF? How about getting up on that roof and discovering where your connections are loose, or which microinverter is causing the effect, or perhaps are all of them in union causing this problem. The reply is " your afci's are not compatable with our panels". My reply is "our afci's are mandatory, and your panels are not, so if you want to collect your money, I suggest you fix your problem, because the city inspector will take a really dim view of you pulling the breakers , since they hate all the pv pirates that now flood our city. I feel for this guy, I kinda feel he is right, it is probably a defect in the afci's that is really at the heart of the problem, but I feel pulling them out is no solution. What ye say?

 

[MTW]

Stand your ground, let the PV hacks fend for themselves.

 

[That_Dude]

What ye say?

Drop that dime to the city inspector. :laughing:

 

[bobelectric]

Dream job... Weather forcaster in Honolulu.

 

[macmikeman]

Dream job... Weather forcaster in Honolulu.

We only want ones who have nice boobs.

 

[Meadow]

I got a call from a customer whom I rewired her 3 bedroom house for a while back. She had hired a PV company to come install panels on her roof, and as soon as the job finished she started having issues with the afci's in the panel tripping randomly and consistently. The afci's have not given trouble in the past. She calls the PV company about it , they send the "electrician" back to the house to troubleshoot the problem. Solution= removed the afci breakers and substituted in standard breakers. So she calls me and tells me what has transpired. I call the pv company and talk to the "electrician" who tells me it is just a test for a week or so to see if the system will trip standard breakers. WTF? How about getting up on that roof and discovering where your connections are loose, or which microinverter is causing the effect, or perhaps are all of them in union causing this problem. The reply is " your afci's are not compatable with our panels". My reply is "our afci's are mandatory, and your panels are not, so if you want to collect your money, I suggest you fix your problem, because the city inspector will take a really dim view of you pulling the breakers , since they hate all the pv pirates that now flood our city. I feel for this guy, I kinda feel he is right, it is probably a defect in the afci's that is really at the heart of the problem, but I feel pulling them out is no solution. What ye say?

:blink:

What am I missing? I don't see it:whistling2:

 

[480sparky]

...... What ye say?

Surf's up... go get your board. :whistling2:

 

[chicken steve]

read the '11 change in 690.11 Mac


~CS~

 

[Magnettica]

How did you come to the conclusion that the AFCI's were the issue when they were working fine until the solar panels? I understand that you feel for the guy but still, the solar installation caused this issue, not bad AFCI breakers.

Out of curiosity, what brand panel are we talking about here?

 

[drspec]

why didn't you do the solar?

 

[wildleg]

I have no reason to have any faith at all in AFCI technology, as I have not yet seen any empirical evidence to show that they work in the manner that they are supposed to.

However, that doesn't take these guys off the hook. I would like to know what is causing them to trip. Any theories ?

 

[sbrn33]

I am thinking about installing PV's in HI. Seems like an easy gig.

 

[chicken steve]

However, that doesn't take these guys off the hook. I would like to know what is causing them to trip. Any theories ?

A grounding issue is my best guess WildOne

To back that keyboard theory up, i'd point out all the '11 grounding changes in 690

In fact, if i were Mac......:whistling2:


~CS~

 

[RGH]

So she wants you to bring your dog to this fight. And now you have. This looks like a no win for you from where I am sitting. 1) you did what by code you had to. 2) they un-did your work to fix their work. 3) she don't like what "they did" and calls you to ....what yell at them whom she hired???...Macman surfs up...grab your bloody dog a six and hit dah beach.....no win column gets a check mark. .....one of bob's rules of life....don't make someone else's problems mine..Me: sorry about your issues with solar ****s....I really don't know what they did or why. My work by code was correct and passed inspection. This issue should maybe directed to the local AHJ I have his number if you would like it....have a NICE day please call me if there is anything we can help you with electrically in the further, again sorry for your situation...

 

[wildleg]

A grounding issue is my best guess WildOne

....

~CS~

that covers a lot of territory.

too much for me to wrap my pea brain around, anyway, especially since I don't do solar.

 

[chicken steve]

that covers a lot of territory.

too much for me to wrap my pea brain around, anyway, especially since I don't do solar.

To be honest, the local solar gurus always beat me out WildOne....

But one thing i do notice about them is, they've very little idea about applying 690,especially when & where they are not subject to any oversight

That said, you've got more code in your pinky than most solar guys i know around here. :thumbsup:So take a look, first @690.11 (direct current arc fault protection) , and then @ Part V of 690 (grounding)

The CMP had a field day with those particular parts of 690 in the '11, not that i'm privy to the substantiation, but the two issues are relevant to each other in the respect that all afci's do is gfpe at best.

~CS~

 

[HARRY304E]

Drop that dime to the city inspector. :laughing:

I already called...:whistling2::laughing:

 

[Elephante]

Hey Mac are the solar panels feeding through the main panel bus bar or are is it tied in load side of the meter..?

 

[Maximumbob]

Is the homeowner hot?

 

[dmxtothemax]

A grounding issue is my best guess

That would be my guess too !

Panels grounded, metal roof, metal down pipes = secondary earth !

GFCI complaining !